[Skill] Influence

[Tarven]

Is this skill working as intended? Are there only mobs which can be influenced? The help doesn't suggest so, but I've used it, literally, over 300 times (200 without, and 100 with a potion of beauty, 10(w/o)14(with) charisma. Skill was trained as high as the trainer I found could take it (Apprentice)

A kobold cultist resists the effect of your spell.
A kobold cultist resists the effect of your spell.
A kobold cultist resists the effect of your spell.
A kobold cultist walks south.
You hear the sound of footsteps from the south.
A kobold cultist resists the effect of your spell.
You failed.
A kobold cultist resists the effect of your spell.
A kobold cultist resists the effect of your spell.
A kobold cultist resists the effect of your spell.
A kobold cultist resists the effect of your spell.
A kobold cultist resists the effect of your spell.
A kobold cultist resists the effect of your spell.

If it only works on certain mobs, please make the help file reflect that? I don't even understand how it's 'resisted' as it's not a spell?

[Althasizor]

Code: Select all

influence bandit
A bandit now follows you.
order bandit dance
A bandit sways to the music only he can hear.
Ok.
order bandit say I'm an amazing dancer!
A bandit exclaims 'I'm an amazing dancer!'
Ok.
A bandit stops following you.
You evade a bandit's crushing attack.

This does work under the correct conditions.

[Gwain]

Influence has very stringent guidlines because you're using your charisma, your charm and strength of will to make another thinking being do whatever you ask of them. So its probably taking that into account.

[Tarven]

Something had occurred to me, being that I have 2 mounts. I'll have to try the bandits, first with the 2 mounts, then without one of them.

What were the conditions required? Could those be added to the help file?

[Enig]

Yeah, I had a look at this skill and apparently it requires 15 or higher charisma to have a chance of working, and the mob has to not have an intercept program on it (frequently used by shopkeepers, for instance, to determine who can buy from them, or by quest mobs).

[Tarven]

Yeah, I had a look at this skill and apparently it requires 15 or higher charisma to have a chance of working, and the mob has to not have an intercept program on it (frequently used by shopkeepers, for instance, to determine who can buy from them, or by quest mobs).

Ahhh okay. Thanks Enig.

[Raona]

Helpfile edited to specify that, with Tarven's help. However, I'm thinking more nuance might be apropos for this skill. Specifically, to make the chance of success depend on the target far more than it does currently: its level, will save, and/or WIS. I think I can pull this off; does this make sense to do?

[Alitar]

That would make sense to me.

[Selveem]

Helpfile edited to specify that, with Tarven's help. However, I'm thinking more nuance might be apropos for this skill. Specifically, to make the chance of success depend on the target far more than it does currently: its level, will save, and/or WIS. I think I can pull this off; does this make sense to do?

I'd agree, but I don't think a thief should be required to have at least 15 Charisma just to have a chance to get the skill to work. It'd be nice if it was a fair trade: mobs get a check against it, but all thieves can attempt it.

[Tarven]

Would there be any way, possibly, to make this skill opposed by sense motive, instead of Will Save? IE the way that disarm is opposed by grip?

I also agree with what Selveem says, in that it would be nice if the skill's requirement for use was reduced, but perhaps the charisma attribute could increase the chance of effect.

But, all in all, it does stand to reason that the target's level and such should play into it. I don't know what the current situation is, but if it's possible for a level 25 character to influence a level 35 mob, for example, then yes, that should certainly be modified.

Really, if an overwork of the skill was being done, I think it'd be neat (and logical) if there was a coin cost involved, where the higher the coin 'offered' the greater your chance of success, but that might not be practical code-wise. Just a hypothetical.

[Raona]

Hmmm, effectively making it bribery? I think that's a neat idea, though it would only work on the non-lawful. Problem is, the more elegant it gets, the less likely it will happen. I don't really know the inner workings of sense motive, and bringing that in might require hard code and thus Mask's invovlement. (Influence uses code I can see and modify; disarm employs hard code, so I'm assuming a sense-motive offset for it would require the same, hence Mask.)

So, let me propose a tweak in stages:

1) I do what I can to tweak the workings of this within skill code. Namely, based on the above, making it something of a competition between the level and charisma of the rogue and the level and wisdom of the target. There would be no hard minimums or maxima, but a weighting of the two against each other, with a random chance thrown in as well. (Possibly resulting in an attack from the target for an epic fail? Thoughts on that?)

2) We put together a "Perfect world" suggestion for the suggestions forum. That is, if we do have Mask work on this, how should it work. It looks like a combination of the more nuanced oddsmaking of (1) coupled with a chance to counter with sense motive would be ideal? Perhaps with a check for target alignment and the possibility they are influenced if you have enough coin in your inventory to make the up the difference between failure and success of the above.

[Tarven]

Hmmm, effectively making it bribery? I think that's a neat idea, though it would only work on the non-lawful. Problem is, the more elegant it gets, the less likely it will happen. I don't really know the inner workings of sense motive, and bringing that in might require hard code and thus Mask's invovlement. (Influence uses code I can see and modify; disarm employs hard code, so I'm assuming a sense-motive offset for it would require the same, hence Mask.)

So, let me propose a tweak in stages:

1) I do what I can to tweak the workings of this within skill code. Namely, based on the above, making it something of a competition between the level and charisma of the rogue and the level and wisdom of the target. There would be no hard minimums or maxima, but a weighting of the two against each other, with a random chance thrown in as well. (Possibly resulting in an attack from the target for an epic fail? Thoughts on that?)

2) We put together a "Perfect world" suggestion for the suggestions forum. That is, if we do have Mask work on this, how should it work. It looks like a combination of the more nuanced oddsmaking of (1) coupled with a chance to counter with sense motive would be ideal? Perhaps with a check for target alignment and the possibility they are influenced if you have enough coin in your inventory to make the up the difference between failure and success of the above.

Sounds good to me! The bribery thing was wild speculation. Just sounded fun. I can't help but wonder if, like, '1 platinum coin' as a spell component, with 100% chance of it being consumed would be possible. But yeah, again, just crazy thoughts.

I like the ideas for #1. I could see a minimum of 10, or even 12, but 15 seems pretty high. I think, originally, the skill was bards only (in fact, the bardic school says that it's a 'unique' ability granted to bards. Clearly, that's not the case any longer, if it once was). I think level/charisma/skill level should be the basis, in addition to the random chance. If that's possible.

As to #2, let's rock it! =) Though, I'm not sure an alignment check restriction would apply. After all, guards and police are, in general, of a lawful nature, but have taken bribes since time immemorial. But, agreed, that's a post for a different thread.