Cavalier?

Erithinal · Post by **Erithinal** » Thu Apr 14, 2005 1:50 am

I was just thinking, as I had recently started a new character. What about the Cavalier prestige class? For all those people that like the Mounted Cavalry type of character, I think it would be a good addition. They would have some more specialized skills on horseback, like a fighter does on the ground. Also, I was thinking of a 'charge' command, or something of the sorts. For example. Say you're wielding a spear, or even sword, and spot a...Orc, for example, in the next room. Now, you do your emotes and such, and then type 'charge east orc' This would make your character and horse charge east, and make a devastating first round attack, that would then ensue regular combat. And even for like, spear based cavalry. There could be a 'skewer' command, that allows you to punch your spear into an opponent, and inflict a bleeding wound, much like the arterial strike feat, but for warriors. Just a couple ideas, Leave your comments, good or bad :/

Argentia · Post by **Argentia** » Thu Apr 14, 2005 2:09 am

OoooOooOOo Cavaliers!

I was excited to see this post be started. I would love a cavalier prestige class, but that would, of course, require a prestige class quest submition.

Reading over this, I have come to realize that there are already quite a few feats appropriate for a cavalier, already... There are many mounted feats already, such as trample, mounted rescue, spirited charge(I LOVE this one), mounted combat, mounted archery(Although that would not be appropriate for a cavalier - they do not use ranged weapons) and last but not least saddleback.(But I have yet to see this feat - perhaps not in the game)

Either way, I think the cavalier class is awesome, but I am very much biased. I'll add more comment later when I have the time, but I just wanted to make you aware of the feats already in the game that would be good for a cavalier.

Erithinal · Post by **Erithinal** » Thu Apr 14, 2005 3:18 am

Yes well, I do understand there are already a good set of cavalier feats out there. But we can also expand upon those, and make them even more specialized than they already are. Such as mounted combat. You could make it so that it is a mounted combat that gives you twice the bonus to hitting something. Or have a mounted combat weapon specialization.

Gwain · Post by **Gwain** » Thu Apr 14, 2005 6:08 am

You can submit this to the apllications email and with all details and ideas for setting up this prestige class, then go to check the prestige class submission posts in the Administrative announcements and Game changes board at the top of the forum. Great ideas but that might be a better place for them. I'd put a link for the forum but fo the life of me it is too long for the page.

Alaudrien · Post by **Alaudrien** » Thu Apr 14, 2005 5:33 pm

This is slightly off topic but...To try and get a prestige class implemented you have to submit a quest for said class to become it?

Isolrem · Post by **Isolrem** » Thu Apr 14, 2005 7:55 pm

In the meantime, I think there are enough resources in the game to RP a cavalier, as a Paladin perhaps.

Alaudrien · Post by **Alaudrien** » Thu Apr 14, 2005 8:12 pm

ah cool...Ima work on a quest then! -cackle!-

Kregor · Post by **Kregor** » Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:20 pm

I would go along with the angle that a "cavalier" or equivalent, for the present can be accomplished thru a fighter with the appropriate feats, skills and faith. Several chars already use this idea, and it is a good bridge until prestige classes are in fact implemented, once so, perhaps you will be well on your way with the char to assume that prestige class.

As it has been done previously in FK, a char who calls themselves a cavalier is a "knight errant" warrior, with some obvious limitations from a paladin. They do not have the divine spellcasting, nor the title of "Sir" or "Knight" as underwritten by their church. On the other hand, they are not bound to some of the monastic rites such as chastity, unless it is in your personal RP.

There is a D20 supplement called the "Cavalier's Handbook", which gives a nice definition of the cavalier: "More than just a mounted warrior... the cavalier represents excellence in arms, unsurpassed equestrian skill, and a devotion to the code of chivalry."

Fighters have the distinction of having just about every combat skill, weapon, and feat at their disposal, as well as some Paladins do NOT have (notable amons them is disarm and fifth attack). And they have the feats like saddleback, spirited charge, mounted combat and rescue, and the like to make the ultimate cavalryman.

Argentia · Post by **Argentia** » Thu Apr 14, 2005 10:51 pm

If anyone is looking for cavalier resources, here is a good one:
http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/cavalier.php

I have a few more sources, if you're interested in them contact me and I'll be glad to find them for you.

In the meantime, I think there are enough resources in the game to RP a cavalier, as a Paladin perhaps

I think was Isolrem meant was that a paladin can RP being a cavalier; in my research I have found that the cavalier "kit" is appropriate for both fighters and paladins to take. Not sure how appropriate it is for a paladin on FK to take it, however.

Also, considering writing this PrC quest myself. If anyone else is interested, feel free to contact me so maybe we can swap ideas.

Isolrem · Post by **Isolrem** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 7:55 pm

Yes, I think cavaliers are correctly paladins? Certainly all knights require squiredom and such...

Argentia · Post by **Argentia** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:17 pm

A cavalier can be either a paladin or a fighter. A cavalier is simply the eptiome of the mounted warrior, the gentlemanly knight figure. S/he follows a strict moral code that is common to paladins, but which a fighter may still adopt. If a fighter adopts the code of the Cavalier, they still enjoy some freedoms that a Paladin may not. For example, they would not be limited to just 10 magical items, or they may not have to swear a vow of chastity. In addition, a paladin must be lawful good, but a cavalier only needs to be of good alignment. Just a few examples.

Hope that clears things up. =)

Isolrem · Post by **Isolrem** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 10:20 pm

yeah, got confused as cavaliers are a paladin kit. I think lawful good should be a requirement though.
we already have many mounted feats, a cavalier is not that hard to RP.

Kregor · Post by **Kregor** » Sat Apr 16, 2005 1:56 am

The fact that most of the mounted feats and skills are present already and accessible to fighters = the cavalier is not that difficult an RP??

If you take the time to actually observe the RP of the people who RP cavalier types on FK, I think you will see that there is a concerted effort on the players' part to mold that char into "not just an everage fighter." Just because you do not have to squire, does not mean the RP is not a challenge. *Any* good RP is a challenge. It doesn't matter what class you play, if you play a three dimensional char with a backstory, personality, quirks and the like.

There's mandatory RP, then there's voluntary RP. To become a paladin, the RP is mandatory. To RP a cavalier, is a voluntary decision on the part of the player. Either one can yield a richly played char.

And as far as tabletop relationships of paladins to cavaliers... i has been all over the board for the past 25 years. In 1st edition D&D, the Paladin was a subclass of the cavalier, not vice versa, as of Unearthed Arcana 1, and therefore a more specialized, more demanding char. In 2nd edition, the cavalier became a subclass (kit) of a paladin. And finally, in 3E, it is a prestige class, open to pretty much any warrior class and does not have to have any attachment to paladinhood at all. So yes, it is, in 3E perspective, possible to be a cavalier and not a paladin.

Isolrem · Post by **Isolrem** » Sat Apr 16, 2005 3:42 am

That was very expansive, and very nice, Kregor.
An RP application and some time of RP is all you need to make a Cavalier.

Hrosskell · Post by **Hrosskell** » Fri Jul 01, 2005 9:41 pm

Maybe I'm a little late for this discussion, but I have some input. I have a little-known Helmite character that was made some time ago, because I wanted a character that was a change from wild and crazy Hrosskell. He called himself a cavalier, and I planned on taking all the mounted feats (except archery) for him. But enough about him, the cavalier is the subject.

I did a lot of research on knights of the medieval time period for a class, and found out that the word chivalry and cavalier are very closely related. A cavalier is bound by the laws of chivalry, but not necessarily chastity. He does -not- have to be good, it's more a matter of the chivalry, I believe, and you can have an evil person who is very well-mannered. Anyone who would roleplay the link a cavalier has with his mount, the style of combat, and the manners of such a character should be able to call himself that; it doesn't seem to me as to be a necessity for any application or whatnot. As far as a prestige class goes, when the administrators figure that out, it sounds wonderful, but it should not be limited to only good warriors.

I dunno if that added anything to this discussion, or if I made a fool of myself, but that's what I know/think.

Zilvryn · Post by **Zilvryn** » Fri Jul 01, 2005 10:26 pm

Isolrem wrote:That was very expansive, and very nice, Kregor.
An RP application and some time of RP is all you need to make a Cavalier.

Who said you needed to apply to make a cavalier?

Currently in FK, a cavalier is a concept which is fully catered to, if you wish to make a paladin who is a cavalier there should be an app to become a paladin, otherwise, make a fighter, take your mounted feats and RP being a noble mounted warrior...

Argentia · Post by **Argentia** » Sat Jul 02, 2005 2:53 am

Hrosskell, you make a good point, but the problem is that D&D dictates that a cavalier must be good. The Complete Fighter's Handbook states about cavaliers:

Cavaliers follow a strict code of chivalry and wavering from that code would result in the character losing their special abilities. Cavaliers must be of any good alignment

And just to me, the word chivalry always went along with a "goodly" sort of person. But that's just me.

Zilvryn, the only problem is that a cavalier must be of nobility. From the same source,

Also, the character must belong to the noble social class in the campaign. It's up to the DM to determine whether this is possible. If his campaign uses a random die-roll to determine who's nobility and who isn't, then the character must first successfully roll to be a noble in order to be a Cavalier. Being a noble does not mean that that he has a lot of money; it is quite likely that he belongs to an impoverished noble family, one with a lot of honorable tradition but no money to speak of.

And being noble requires an application. So unless the imms decide it is not necessary in FK to be noble to be a cavalier, then it requires an app.

Glim · Post by **Glim** » Sat Jul 02, 2005 3:01 am

Who said a cavalier must be a noble?

Argentia · Post by **Argentia** » Sat Jul 02, 2005 3:07 am

Who said a cavalier must be a noble?

The Complete Fighter's Handbook did. But like I said, unless the imms say otherwise, then a cavalier should technically be noble.

Glim · Post by **Glim** » Sat Jul 02, 2005 3:17 am

Cavaliers dont get special abilities or privileges in FK though, as such, they are more of a title than anything. Any warrior can take mounted combat feats and call themselves a cavalier, without having to be restricted to sending in an application for nobility or forcing them to stick to a certain line of roleplay to do such. If they wish to be a cavalier, why not?