Kneeling before the gods

Gwain · Post by **Gwain** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 5:46 pm

I've been wondering this as of late, a god is a master of the world no matter how good or evil they are, their every step echoes with power. In essence they are divine.

I have been wondering about the issue of kneeling before the gods, any gods even the ones apposed to your own diety whose every movement icly is to topple that god. Should we still kneel when they appear?

Here are wo possible arguments, to be honest, I'm not sure which is right.

For arguments sake I took a look at the Old Dragonlance novels, a character of goodly alignment is brought before the god of all evil. He bows, kneels and grovels. Later when he is asked why he did such he responds that this deity is still a god and there power is immense and pressence beyond all things is horrific and beautiful to the point that he was so awstruck that for a few moments he felt the need to worship her.

Gods are gods, they are divine and in all cases the shapers of the world, so we should bow down in reverance no matter who they are.

On the other side of the argument, if one is strong enough in faith could they resist the need to bend knee to one so opposed to their lord's will? It might mean death, torture or worse but it might be possible assuming. Could a gathering of fellows of the same faith give you the strength to resist? Could holy archons or paladins resist the urge to kneel to those of an enemy diety?

My problem is that natural fear and mortalty's base nature could sway one to kneel, but the advent of faithfulness could help one to resist to the point that if we did kneel we would be undermining our own ethos.

Both are possibilities, some more for others and less for some

Tazmin · Post by **Tazmin** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 7:11 pm

Having been in this situation a couple of times it does depend a lot on the char. There are a couple gods Tazmin will not kneel to short of them cutting her legs off, and yes, that has happened.

If your char belives that kneeling to say Cyric is a terrible sin in the eyes of whatever god you follow then don't do it, just be prepared for the inevitable smiteing that will occour. Of course a lot of the gods have a lot more sneaky ways of trying to teach you your place then killing you. I remember a certain piggy pixie.

Andreas · Post by **Andreas** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 1:21 am

Andreas has made more than one trip to the Fugue Plain after refusing to kneel before evil gods.

It truly is all a matter of roleplay. My personal RP of my character dictates that he doesn't kneel before evil. Yes, there have been consequences, but I feel it was fabulous roleplay all around.

Forgoil · Post by **Forgoil** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 5:34 am

Alright let me get this straight and just make sure I knoww hat I am doing. Say a Tempurian for example who doesn't have any faith foes. I would only imagine that they would bow down beofre any god correct? Except for maybe Sune but only a fool wouldn't kneel to sune but I am not to sure seeing as of how Tempus sees her as an inconvenience and a waste of time.

Lathander · Post by **Lathander** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 6:31 am

Different gods have different tolerances. Just because a god is "good" doesn't mean he/she tolerates direspect from any mortal, as they are so far beneath the power of a god. Please remember, we're talking IC here, not OOC

As Lathander, a good god of the Dawn, I've been known to use the rays of the sun to sever the legs of those who show any disrespect or open defiance. Kind of hard not to kneel when you have no legs.

Nearraba · Post by **Nearraba** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 3:35 pm

Of course Lathander has a great point. I think of it as, (Of course this all depends on the rp of your character) comparing it to a somwhat real life situation. If you believe, in some sort of god and they randomly showed up before you, what would you be feeling at that moment in time even if it was the "foe" of your god? It's a big chance taking situation- If your willing to test the will and power of the gods. They could be the most sweetest goddess in the realms, but maybe she broke her nail and is having the worst day... would you really want to take the chance of getting your head chopped off? Just my opinion, though as stated many times it all depends on your play of character.

...Hope that made since..

Algon · Post by **Algon** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 3:47 pm

Forgoil wrote:Alright let me get this straight and just make sure I knoww hat I am doing. Say a Tempurian for example who doesn't have any faith foes. I would only imagine that they would bow down beofre any god correct? Except for maybe Sune but only a fool wouldn't kneel to sune but I am not to sure seeing as of how Tempus sees her as an inconvenience and a waste of time.

Once again it all depends on the character. Algon will show respect and perhaps bow his head when an evil Deity shows up, but it is highly doubtful that he will kneel unless forced. And any IC consequences will be happily accepted.
As far as Sune goes...Weither or not Algon will bow to her depends on if she has her knife or not hehe.

Gwain · Post by **Gwain** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 4:06 pm

I've seen people turned into pudding or sensible furniture for not kneeling before certain gods, though it cannot be forced or might seem contradictory to your rp I give you a marvelous helpfile I found in the mud that might justify it. Bear in mind though that it is your rp, and if you can accept the reprocussions of your actions and take responsibility than you can do whatever you want as long as you do not break the rules of the game, just don't expect nothing to happen.

Conduct before a deity
======================
Most people know to conduct themselves with the proper respect and awe in the
presence a deity. However, for the sake of those who are unfamiliar with
such etiquette or who have need of a memory refresher, we provide these
simple, easy to follow guidelines. If you follow this outline, it should keep
you out of unnecessary trouble with offended deitiess and perhaps even
enhance their view of your roleplaying.

Initial Contact with an Deity

Think...what would you do if the head deity of your religion in real life
suddenly manifested before you? Would you yawn? Would you say, "Heya, God,
how are things?" Would you take no notice? In reality, after you finished
wetting your leggings, you would most likely be paralyzed by a combination of
fear, awe, and joy. Roleplay this. Bowing to an immortal is not enough,
especially if you have never been in his or her presence before. Kneeling is
good, and prostrating yourself before the deity is also acceptable. Note
that this is not just before the deity that you follow or wish to follow,
but also before ANY deity, whether you respect their sphere of influence or
not. It is also common practice to ask permission before looking directly at
any immortal. A deity like Cyric would like to see you grovel in the dirt
but one like Mystra would prefer that you kneel.

This is from the Help Conduct file, a very informative file for interactions with a deity.

Just because you kneel does not mean you shame your own god. A deity is a deity, a being of divine power and might that can rip your head off and sew a pigs noggin on your neck with a thought. It is a scary thing, but it happens. In character rp in novels there are examples, In Dragonlance, Tanis, Half Elven kneeled to the Queen of Darkness, a very evil go just because the power she radiated made him want to almost worship her, I could see this happening as an excuse to kneel ingame. Of course it is your responsibility to decide what your fate is, and I'm never one to do anything but suggest, but, for example if you do not want to kneel before Cyric because you serve Kelemvor, then you'll be dead, and his followers may gain an upper hand, it goes hand in hand with rp though and it is always up to the player how they will act.

Kneeling before the gods

Kneeling before the gods

RE: Kneeling to gods