shortage of components?

[Balek]

Out of curiosity, why are most spell components limited at all? Most spell components are trivial little things that cost a few copper or silver coins. Especially in a place like Waterdeep these things should always be in stock barring some kind of major siege/blockade RP going on. Is there some kind of technical hurdle in the way of making them unlimited, or is this a philosophical choice? If it's been a conscious choice to limit even trivial spell components, what is the reasoning? I can't think of any benefit this provides to anyone. I think going to the trouble of managing your pouch full of spell components is the only hurdle we need to have for most spells. You shouldn't have to trek halfway across the world to find a flask of water or some bark. It's not fun, it doesn't aid in immersion, and it doesn't make sense in our world or a fantasy world. I know Dalvyn has done a lot of work to create ways to get some trivial spell components for free in the wilderness and to get some less-trivial components through other avenues, but this complaint has been a fairly consistent one for a while now. Maybe it's time to rethink the basic system of spell component acquisition.

[Dalvyn]

What spells use them exactly?

As for having a limit, that's something that has to be there in the area code. And, believe me, I have already upped all the limits several times.

[Nysan]

What spells use them exactly?

You mean flasks of water? Spells I know for sure: bless water, winter mist, snowball swarm, ice storm... all four I know I use on a regular basis on several characters. None of my characters have the spells, yet, but I have been told orb of cold and iceshield also use them. Do not have access to all spells, obviously, so I may have missed some. On top of that, add to the list how many flasks are tucked away on various players who bake things like tarts, cakes, stews and you have yourself a large demand for flasks of water and only shops as means to attain them.

[Layna]

Iceshield does indeed use flasks of water, drown (and presumably therefore mass drown?) and polar ray also use it - just to chip in

[Dovan]

I'm not a caster so I can't not say this with 100% promise, but it's 99%. Pretty sure it's Wind Walk as well using it, least for a certain person I know. If it varies by domain use per regular use... then it would apply domain only in this instance.

[Dalvyn]

Do all spells requiring flasks of water use up a whole flask with each casting? Or are there some spells that can be cast several times with only one flask?

[Timaeus]

For alot of items that are out of stock or not even showing on mobs that used to sell them the problem is hoarding of items in player storerooms. While acceptable to some extent to have them in large numbers in the component shop store rooms having them hoarded in personal storerooms and the locker system is causing the NPCs not to load the items at all if their area loads after the storeroom areas. Even if the areas load first many NPC shopkeepers are not sufficiently coded to overcome the levels to which they are being hoarded. I did some locate objects and some interesting things showed up. Other noteable areas where items are 'hoarded' regarding counters are the Corpse Conservatory and the Pantheon Store(room) each holds the items as in game and against the counters allowing them to be sold.

a blank scroll (139) in A cache in the bole of the tree.
a glass flask (94) in A Large Square Room.
a flask of water (486) in A Large Square Room.

Also the blank scrolls empty flasks retain their vnum once they have been scribed so any scrolls or brewed flasks people have in store rooms also count against the limits. Responsibly a player should keep all components and items that they hold in large numbers on them so when they log out they are removed from the counters and can restock and be sold again. The out of stock would be temporary, only when that character is online.

Items hoarded in player storerooms and the locker system in quantity could and should be removed from the storerooms by immortals if the problem is not corrected by the owners within a reasonable time period of say a week or two.

[Timaeus]

Do all spells requiring flasks of water use up a whole flask with each casting? Or are there some spells that can be cast several times with only one flask?

I have tried all the priest spells that I have that require blessed water, the component that comes from flask of water for priest spells. Heal, Sanctuary, Shield of Faith, Divine Favor. All use up a complete flask of blessed water per casting.

On my Wizard for Flask of Water, Iceshield, Winter Mist, and Ice Storm are the only spells I have and they each use a complete Flask of Water per casting.

[Nysan]

Do all spells requiring flasks of water use up a whole flask with each casting? Or are there some spells that can be cast several times with only one flask?

1 flask per spell, like manure/bulls strength, for every spell I posted eariler. I have no reason to doubt drown/mass drown are the same. Baking tarts and the like are also 1 per item.

[Nysan]

Do all spells requiring flasks of water use up a whole flask with each casting? Or are there some spells that can be cast several times with only one flask?

I have tried all the priest spells that I have that require blessed water, the component that comes from flask of water for priest spells. Heal, Sanctuary, Shield of Faith, Divine Favor. All use up a complete flask of blessed water per casting.

On my Wizard for Flask of Water, Iceshield, Winter Mist, and Ice Storm are the only spells I have and they each use a complete Flask of Water per casting.

Do flasks of water retain their vnum after being made into blessed water? I assumed they changed to the bless water vnum, so I turned them almost as soon as I bought them on my priests to keep the flasks of water flowing.

[Selveem]

Items hoarded in player storerooms and the locker system in quantity could and should be removed from the storerooms by immortals if the problem is not corrected by the owners within a reasonable time period of say a week or two.

I'd go as far as to say that components left in dwellings (not in the room required for the shopkeeper) and player storage should be purged if, after the first warning from the staff, the player decides to continue leaving their stash in a way that is detrimental to the game.

If the count cannot be avoided, I don't think it's responsible of players to keep leaving components in areas they don't want other players retrieving them.

[Nysan]

Mounts and the luggage system logs out with the character as well, correct? So characters that, for whatever reason, cannot carry components on themselves could store them and not conflict with area item limits on area loading, right?

[Timaeus]

Mounts and the luggage system logs out with the character as well, correct? So characters that, for whatever reason, cannot carry components on themselves could store them and not conflict with area item limits on area loading, right?

From recent locate objects and the post on luggage system it appears that they items are stored all the time and do not log out with the character Dalyvn would be able to answer this with more certainty than I can. Mounts do log out of the counting when the player logs out. I do not see a reason they should hoard them on a mount if they can not carry them. Hoarding them in that quantity only really means you are out spam casting the spells to just gain skill levels IE twinking. (Don't deny it, its that obvious) So those players should be forced to go back and find new components when they run out instead of taking up the availablity of components from people who need them and take roleplay approach to the game not a "see if i can be the bestest with the mostest spell levels" approach to the game.

Do flasks of water retain their vnum after being made into blessed water? I assumed they changed to the bless water vnum, so I turned them almost as soon as I bought them on my priests to keep the flasks of water flowing.

Blessed Water created by the spell creates an entirely new object with different vnum.

[Sairaven]

I would like to chime in and say that Poison Weapon also uses the flasks of water.

[Nysan]

Yea, was a bit hazy on just how the luggage system stored items. Still, packrats still have mounts to store and not conflict. Please note, I am not avocating hoarding or power-leveling. But, if some folks "must" do it... might as well suggest hoarding in ways that it will limit impact on other players and areas. A player logging in and moving a few bags from their house to their stabled mount is faster than adding 'deletion project' to the imm 'to-do' list.

Not against the deletion of hoarded components in houses either. They are spell components after all, not some once-in-a-lifetime quest item. Well, that and none of my characters hoard or even have a house to worry about.

Good to hear how I thought 'bless water' worked was the corrected way. Always wondered about that. Does the 'makeholy'/'makeunholy' commands change the vnum as well, or is that merely a cosmetic change?

[Duranamir]

There is another couple of reasons for "hoarding" that is if you regularly trade in components to other players. And if you can not access the normal sources of supply due to race or hometown.

Still if items are always held on the player or a mount this should only cause a problem when that player is logged on ? What about carts, i presume they log out with the player who owns them ?

Duranamir

[Nysan]

There is another couple of reasons for "hoarding" that is if you regularly trade in components to other players. And if you can not access the normal sources of supply due to race or hometown.

Still if items are always held on the player or a mount this should only cause a problem when that player is logged on ? What about carts, i presume they log out with the player who owns them ?

Duranamir

Carts log out with the player, long as they are claimed that is, so it would not conflict with area loading.

[Liandria]

Seems like "a pinch of sulphur" is another component that is having shortages. I know an NPC shop where it is sold, but everytime I try to buy it now I get the message:

"XXXXX says to you 'That item is out of stock at the moment"

[Aveline]

I just checked two shops that Lia would have access to...and they sold me sulphur. Just need to broaden your shopping a bit on that one.

[Liandria]

Now that doesn't make sense, how can one vendor be telling me the item is out of stock, and another still be selling? Maybe someone with the hoarded components logged off.

Edit: Ok I've checked another couple stores with sulphur, flown halfway around the game, and I'm still getting the same results as before. "That item is out of stock at the moment." Maybe Aveline is just prettier. :/ but they keep refusing to sell me the component. They offer it in their lists, but won't take my money.