Hitall

[Dranso]

I was told by quite a few people that hitall had been removed from the game. Recently I found a place to train it so I figure it has been put back in and has been changed somehow. Does the skill now work automaticly? If not, is there a command to use it? If its still gone maybe it can be put back with changes to help even out fighters?

[Horace]

Back in the day I use to think it was pretty fair for fighters. Now looking at it, it's like flamestrike but without a component cost...and you're a fighter.

It's still not in the game, as far as I know. If it is, the command is "hitall"

[Harroghty]

Just to confirm: I tried this skill today and it didn't work.

[Dranso]

Maybe hitall could become an ability like turn undead. Fighters could only use it 6 times a day. By the way what are the chances of hitall making it back into the game?

[Lerytha]

I think from the (almost) united reaction in agreement the time it was removed, personally speaking, I think next to zero. I am not speaking on behalf of the imms here, just personal feelings.

a) It has no basic in D&D
b) It allows (unrealistically) a fighter to hit everyone in a room - and if they had many attacks, it would do a lot of damage to everyone in a room.
c) It was very unbalanced

There may be other reasons (and other people to want it back), but those three are enough (I feel) for it to warrant never being brought into the game again.



~Ol

[Harroghty]

On the contrary:

-This skill does have a basis in Dungeons and Dragons proper:

Whirlwind Attack - One melee attack against each opponent within reach

PHB e3.5, p. 91

Now, this doesn't seem to translate exactly but since an opponent in combat is able to attack someone in the back rank of a formation perhaps it does? At the very least this feat provides a basis for the skill.

-This is only unrealistic in the sense that it is impractical. If you read anything about the Angelo brothers (c.18th century) or "Nouveau Traite" by Girard this the exactly the method they are suggesting for engaging two opponents. The difficulty begins with more than two opponents because speed is of the essence, a stopping attack and a very deliberate attack on two opponents respectively is -quickly performed- a good way to not be dead. With any more than two opponents this becomes the stuff of Errol Flynn movies or the "masterful" swordplay of Connor McCleod.

-In the end, in its old condition, the skill is unfair. It could be tweaked perhaps to be more in-line with the original feat from the game proper, but I am not sure it's worth all the effort this would require. Fighters have plenty of good skills available to them right now and the feats that are being implemented for them will fill the extant gaps.

So, in the end, I agree. I do not think there is a need for this skill even if some players may desire it.

[Saranya]

I will not nitpick too much, but I doubt Whirlwind was ever invisioned to be anything akin the nightmare that was Hitall. Ah, never-ending are the debates of gamers...

I believe Kregor said it best;

Hitall, for the record, was taken out because it was 1) bugged and allowed people to get up to 12 extra attacks a round on everyone in the room, as fast as you could spam the command. and 2) it was unbalancing, as even whirlwind attack in D&D takes somewhere along the lines of 4 feats as prerequisites, and even then, it only fires off once per round, and replaces ALL other attacks that round, AND can only hit all opponents within reach of your weapon in a circle, which means up to 9 opponents surrounding you.

I, for one, am happy to see it gone for good...even if I still daydream about slaying 90 undead with one bold stroke of my Mighty Sunblade.

[Selveem]

Philosophical question: What's the difference between hitting a few extra times per round as a fighter and a cleric able to strike three times per round and cast at least twice per round?

And, not to say Kregor is wrong, but from my experience it did not permit 12 extra hits per round [but admittedly more than three] because I have tried spamming it before when Boe and I were dueling and all gloves were off. There was a _slight_ lag to the command, whether it was built into the command itself or just the MUD itself.

[Dovan]

If spamming was the problem, is it possible to code the skill with possibly two different timers to it? One timer would be a short timer, 5... at worst 10 seconds where it allows you to do the hitall attack. During this time, you remain flat-footed and unable to return attacks (set status to nofight). That or perhaps like with trades where it limits you to no actions until it completes. The second timer being a re-use timer of like 30 seconds or a minute.

This way the skill could be used to save yours or your groups hide in rare situations, but not allowing the skill use in a battle repeatedly. It's just an idea only to help perhaps meet a middle ground between those that do not wish to see it and those that would like it back.

[Nysan]

Speaking from my fighter half, old Gilain, I am not looking forward to this skill's return without some serious tweaking. Usage lag bump is a start, but nowhere near enough.

[Atraos]

Hey

Just looking at the previous history of hitall, i recently trained this around a month ago. If there are no intentions of adding it back into the game perhaps it is time to remove the trainers and amened the helpfiles accordingly?

[Raona]

Modified helpfile. It's a low priority for a fix, so a warning to that effect is probably called for.