Good elf to bad elf relations

Kirkus · Post by **Kirkus** » Thu Aug 14, 2003 2:48 am

This just happened to me and it isn't the first time. A good elf walks into the room, looks at me nods or smiles at me and walks away. Now for those of you who don't see the problem in this let me give you a little info. I am evil. Tonight I am marking it up to inexperience. Now before you all go and yell at me, think about this. With most elves being good, how would they react to an evil elf. I sure don't think they would like it. Now you may ask " How are we supposed to know you are evil?" Well one good clue would be the symbol of faith I wear. True a lot of the time I have it hidden, but when I don't it should be a dead give away. How many good faiths have as a symbol a bolt of lightning or three? I know alot of us don't know every symbol we have coded and what fait they all stand for but there are ways to find out. First there is the deities page from the old site. Or you could oocly ask. I feel most people in the realms would grow up with the knowledge of the gods and at least their symbols. Now my big question is how do you react to the few evil elves out there? How would society react?

Andreas · Post by **Andreas** » Thu Aug 14, 2003 1:14 pm

Based on what I've read in the FR novels about elves, drow are the only "elven" race that surface elves would attack and kill on sight by the old adage of shoot first and ask questions later. Then again, the majority of surface elves don't truly consider drow to be elves any more.

In most cases, elves (speaking only of surface elves here and not drow) are very reluctant to (A)conceive of the possibility of evil within one of their own race and (B)take drastic measures about it. Kymil Nimesin was a trusted and honoured member of the elven community of Evereska until his plots to assassinate King Zaor, pin numerous assassinations on Arilyn Moonblade and invade Evermeet were brought to light. Even after the first two offenses, he was only exiled into an extraplanar "jail" until Lloth and Malar freed him for the invasion of Evermeet.

Going further back, Coronal Eltargrim was deeply disturbed when he was forced to defend himself against Lady Starym and killed her when she took the form of a blood dragon in an attempt to assassinate him.

The elves of the Moonwood (I think? Please correct me if I'm wrong on the forest.) were extremely regretful that one of their clan was so mentally deranged as to seek out sword training all her life and hunt down Drizzt Do'Urden for perceived wrongs. Again, the clan had no intention of killing their own, but only to confine and seek help and healing for her.

What each individual PC does is, of course, a matter of personal choice. The gods of chaos are enemies of the Seldarine, so elves should have a pretty good chance of recogizing their symbols. An openly worn symbol would certainly invite criticism by good elves. However, if concealed, the evil elf could probably move with ease in elven society - further stirring up plots and trouble.

Lathlain · Post by **Lathlain** » Thu Aug 14, 2003 9:58 pm

I believe Jon Irenicus from Baldur's Gate 2 was also an Elf, albeit long exiled. He was disgraced horribly and had all ties with the Seldarine irrevocably severed. In this case they had no trouble recognising he and his sister Bodhi to be evil of heart, but still they deemed exile to be a more suitable punishment to death in the hope that he would eventually return to them.
It is also often the case that evil Elves themselves refuse to acknowledge that they are actually evil. *Most* (and I say most because there are exceptions... I'd be hypocritical if I said otherwise

) Elves who have become corrupt are those who merely seek to achieve something that may have evil consequences, or require evil means. Rarely does an Elf become seen as truly evil, and rarer still do they set out to do evil intentionally.

Kirkus · Post by **Kirkus** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 3:08 pm

Very true. But the reverie is only one more reason that the elven society will feel sory for elves that turn evil. But more than that they will feel that they themselves have failed.

Kirkus · Post by **Kirkus** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 3:30 pm

I think I was actually wanting to know how they felt about their brethren turning evil. And how they would iteract with one that they know is evil. True the quick glance dosn't always offer 100%clarity on weather or not an elf is good or evil, but I agree with what Andreas said, "The gods of chaos are enemies of the Seldarine, so elves should have a pretty good chance of recogizing their symbols. An openly worn symbol would certainly invite criticism by good elves."

Lathlain · Post by **Lathlain** » Fri Aug 15, 2003 9:06 pm

Being ignored? Ack, a fate worse than death! It should cause a great deal of strife in such an Elf to see one of their ilk become petty and sadistic, and as such it is a lot of fun to play on that.
I think, given the typical level of arrogance present in the Elven race, it is not as likely that they would simply ignore the presence of a corrupt Elf. Perhaps I am wrong, but this is how I have always thought it to be.

Lathander · Post by **Lathander** » Sat Aug 16, 2003 7:39 pm

Remember too that if this happens in Waterdeep, the others might simply ignore your evil nature so as not to flirt with the no-nasty policy.

Penryn · Post by **Penryn** » Mon Sep 22, 2003 8:51 am

In playing an elf, I would honestly say he would feel sadness and shame towards the individual but more so upon the fact that he would turn to Any human or lesser racial diety no matter what one. Except the rare few that seem commonly accepted as allies of the Seledraine.. No matter good or evil.. after all you have given yourself off towards a god of a weaker race and less fullfill placement...

But as for actions towards you.. perhaps he would try to help assist you back towards a more true path.. now if you brought harm to one of his kin specially a sunrise elf ... well that would be another story... but in the eyes of a priest really it would be more as try to reform instead of lose the child of Corellon.. and perhaps he/she will give up their fickle path in time...

If Elaith Craulenborn(sp) could earn back his moonblades power by actions.. heck anyone can be reborn to a proper place into the path of the Seldraine.

But this is just my two cents into the picture of course doesnt mean right or wrong

Jeffery

(Edited to remove some IC information - Sharni)

Andreas · Post by **Andreas** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 1:15 pm

Eliath Craulnober

And while he regained the power of his Moonblade, he also never took it up because he knew that it would kill him.

I TRULY hope that some day there'll be a story written about his daughter... of course, TSR/WoTC would SERIOUSLY have to jump the campaign timeline forward so she could grow to adulthood! lol

I agree with Penryn: most elves would be ashamed to admit that one of their kind (A) fell to evil and (B) became faithful to anything of the "lesser" races. Just look at how Arilyn Moonblade is treated and she is of royal blood! Her mother choose self exile rather than face the pity and censure of The People for loving a human and bearing his child.

But harm an elf and their vengeance is a cold thing long time in coming.

Rennick · Post by **Rennick** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 1:17 am

I was reading the responses to this post, and Andreas mentioned that elves would kill drow on sight, no questions asked. Well, that got me thinking back to another topic about how PC enemies should react to one another, what with the restricted pk policy on FK. I was just curious, especially to those of you who play elven characters, how you think elven characters should treat drow characters when and if they meet? Should there be violence, or simply just unfriendly banter? Just a thought I had. Any responses would be appreciated.

Kregor · Post by **Kregor** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 2:09 am

I have seen elf/drow RP when the twain meet, or, rather, elf/halfdrow, which most elves would still regard as drow as they tend to favor their drow parent more than their human one, and the racial hatred is still there.

Regardless.... while the PK restrictions do not not allow just outright, immediate killing, killing with RP (and OOC courtesy) is allowed. Though most encounters are met with hostility, not necessarily killing. It is concievable that such an encounter would end up in a smoted battle, and possibly a pkill.

The main thing in all the RP is that the tensions between the two races be reflected and RPed properly. This is a dark ages fantasy period and racial tensions and bigotry run rampant, it is not the era equality and diversity. Orcs and elves hate each other, Malarites hate elves, elves hate drow, halflings hate goblins, humans of Sembia and the Moonsea hate pretty much everyone who isn't human, etc. It's important that we remember in RP, as much as we may IRL be in favor of ideals like multiculturalism, et al in the modern world, that that is not the stuff that Forgotten Realms conflicts are made of.

Amalia · Post by **Amalia** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 7:15 am

Did I manage to come up with this myself somehow, or isn't there something the Elven nation can do as a whole to cut off an individual that they've decided should be an exile? Such an Elf could not gain the comfort of Reverie connecting him to other elves, could not go west when the time came, and would eventually wither and die due to his unnatural, disconnected evil state. It seems to me, from what I've read, that it's just plain unnatural for a (surface) Elf to be evil and counter to other elves. As such, an evil elf would have become so only with strong reasons, and would suffer for it, because his elven soul still needs the nation, and even if he's not cut off actively, needs to be *like* the rest of the nation.

With that impression in mind, were I playing an Elf I think I'd be inclined to try to help the other Elf get back to how he's "supposed" to be, and let the Powers That Be among the Elven nation know about him, since he's bound to be a rarity and a danger. If it's decided that he should be exiled, I'd ignore him completely. And if the Elf is already exiled... well, I'm of the opinion that any Elf having contact with other Elves should already know about any of those. There shouldn't be more than a (very small) handful nasty enough that a nation of practically immortal beings would put the stamp of eternal damnation on them.

Rennick · Post by **Rennick** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 10:11 pm

Hmmm...I was just thinking about what Amalia said about elven outcasts, and how they would be entirely cut off from the rest of the community...I was wondering to what extent they were cut off spiritually, as Fenmarel acts as a god to elven outcasts, if I am not mistaken. Just something I was curious about.

Good elf to bad elf relations

Good elf to bad elf relations

Re: Evil Elves

evil elves and one perspective

RE: Bad Elf gone .... sorta good...

Just a thought...