Follower of <Insert God name> abilities:

Selveem · Post by **Selveem** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 4:55 pm

You know, after reading the group abilities thread, it kind of got me thinking..

I used to play on a MUD where when you joined certain "Clans" (which could also be considered Cults), you gained special abilities.

For instance, one Clan had the ability to occasionally invoke "Romulus Rage" which gave a big bonus to damage from melee, but was otherwise useless.

Another Clan got to stalk people, if I remember correctly. Meaning, there was no check on their 'sneak' - it was automatic success. Unable to be heard by another. Was _very_ effective for ambushing others.

Now, while these are extreme examples, I think the idea could be applied here.

I could see a Dwarf of Moradin using a mace, hammer, or other blunt weapon to make a concussive blow. It would be like a regular strike and stun for a single round. A Halfling of Yondalla able to "prepare" food that would completely remove hunger (as if you ate enough to get 'full') and give a slight bonus to con.. Maybe +2.

These are just some thoughts to add cool new little things to the game.

Harroghty · Post by **Harroghty** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 5:40 pm

This is an intriguing idea and, I think, a good one. I think, however, that by assigning certain abilities to each member of a certain faith you run the risk of attracting people to certain faiths for the wrong reasons. Combat-related bonuses or those suited a certain class could create a run on certain faiths. Yes, the Faith Manager (FM) could serve as a vetting process but then you create a hindrance (the suspicion) to genuine applicants.
I propose that such abilities could be assigned by FMs or by the actual deities instead of being assigned to all members of a certain faith. This way these skills are subjected to more thorough examination without slighting players trying to join a certain faith.

Selveem · Post by **Selveem** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 6:07 pm

I actually thought about that. Honestly, people already run to certain faiths. The more I think about this as a possibility, the less inclined I'm to believe this will be the determining factor.

When Malarites got track for free regardless of class skill or not (maybe just priests, but I think I remember Tretch had it too), you didn't see a sudden influx of Malarites. In fact, the only two I've ever met that I can remember are Tretch and Danten. Sure, I've probably met more but I'm an old man now and forgetful.

I can, however, say that their numbers didn't skyrocket.

Mask faith has always been popular. That his priests got backstab and steal free didn't increase his faith's popularity either.

I don't, however, agree that only FMs should be able to give the abilities. Maybe there can be some long, involved quests written up by the FM (or failing the faith even having one [such as Tempus]) be written up by whoever is the highest ranking and/or oldest, active member. The reason I believe this is because, no offense to any FMs, but most faiths either don't have one or their FM can't be online often/if ever.

And my idea was just an idea. Anyone can say 'Well I think an Orc of Gruumsh should get Concussive Blow' instead of the Dwarves. Especially if they have a good reason. Ultimately, the decision still resides upon the administration anyhow.

Harroghty · Post by **Harroghty** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 6:22 pm

Those are valid examples, but those are already faiths with specific populations. If all faiths had some kind of ability then you begin to influence people among less specific faiths. Your character might not really prefer Ilmater over Helm or Torm, but they would choose based on that faith's available ability.
I agree that faith managers are scarce (or are not posted) in many faiths so what if the ability was a god's to assign? To create a specific, coded quest for each faith is an Augean task but as role-play develops, certain faithful might warrant a favor from their god and one of these abilities could be it. This alleviates all the potential shortfalls and rewards good role-play with tangible (as something can be in a computer game) benefits.

Kirkus · Post by **Kirkus** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 6:31 pm

I think this is a very good idea. It has always been hard to suggest an idea like this for the problem of approaching multiclassing. I agree that it has never been a problem of people approaching a faith based on what they are gonna get. And if it is, either their rp develops past that point where they become a valid member of their faith or they wash out.

I love the suggestion of questing for faith skills. That is how it should be.

Jaenoic · Post by **Jaenoic** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 8:23 pm

I like this idea a lot, but I would like to point out a few things...

I could see a Dwarf of Moradin using a mace, hammer, or other blunt weapon to make a concussive blow. It would be like a regular strike and stun for a single round.

There is a skill that does this already, called stun, no? Priests, squires and paladins gain this ability I believe. It is like bash but with a blunt weapon.

A Halfling of Yondalla able to "prepare" food that would completely remove hunger (as if you ate enough to get 'full') and give a slight bonus to con.. Maybe +2.

Hmm... What's wrong with the create food prayer? It doesn't give +2 to con but I don't quite understand the reasoning behind giving the con bonus.

Mask faith has always been popular. That his priests got backstab and steal free didn't increase his faith's popularity either.

To my knowledge, this is not true, unless something has changed? I know that Mask favors those who backstab and steal... But I remember that being a problem because priests could no neither, and essentially could not gain favor.

At any rate, I've always thought it'd be cool if faith members did gain some measure of bonuses like these. I'm not sure how canon they are, but in Icewind Dale 2 priests gained various abilities like painbearers of Ilmater gained "pain touch" which caused constitution damage I think, and "Ilmater's endurance" which raised the priests' con or something.

To solve the issue of people joining faiths just for the bonuses, these abilities could be linked to faith levels? Like at prelate you gain this ability, at inner circle you gain that one, but below prelate is not able to use them.

Selveem · Post by **Selveem** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 8:52 pm

Jaenoic, that's not a bad idea. Though, I would caution the faith level being too high. For instance, I made Selveem over 7 years ago. He's still not even Inner Circle. I have no characters that are FMs. Actually, aside from Selveem the highest I have is Acolyte. Aside from that, everyone else is just 'Member.'

Currently, as far as I know, stun does no damage. It only stuns them around. This would still be an improvement if I'm correct. I wouldn't know, however. I've only had stun used on me. I never got a priest high enough.

As far as before, I don't know whether it was intentional or not that Maskites got those abilities. Malarites definitely did, though, because I know what mob trained it. I do know that they aren't done any longer.

As for the Yondalla example, you still have to eat multiple of each food to be full. Possibly having to cast more than once if you have a party there with you. The +2 Con bonus would just be a nice add-on. For having a nice, hearty meal!

Again, it's just examples as suggestions. Feel free to come up with your own.

Edit: After review, I've had Selveem over 8 years.

Kregor · Post by **Kregor** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:37 pm

Jaenoic wrote:
Mask faith has always been popular. That his priests got backstab and steal free didn't increase his faith's popularity either.
To my knowledge, this is not true, unless something has changed? I know that Mask favors those who backstab and steal... But I remember that being a problem because priests could no neither, and essentially could not gain favor.

To set the record straight on this...

Jaenoic is right, the priests of Mask have never gotten backstab, or sneak, or hide, or any other of the skills of thieves as class skills, for as long as I can recall.

While such skills can and could be set directly from a deity to a follower as a gift (and there may be in fact instances of this), more often the source of out-of-guild skills was skill applies from their supplicated objects, items from quest areas they could participate in, etc. Subsequently, you once upon a time, could train up the skill levels of item-granted applies. This was an unintentional affect of item applies and the way it interacted with the skill improvement code. (ie, it was code abuse.) You should only be able to actually learn from either trained, or innate skills. This has since been corrected in hard code. And all clerics, aside from their domain and/or racial abilities, have the same skill set across the board.

Selveem · Post by **Selveem** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:48 pm

Ah, I appreciate that Kregor.

Kirkus · Post by **Kirkus** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 7:16 pm

So what is the verdict... the discussion on this kinda died out. I think as long as we keep faith abilities small, like resistances and perhaps some showy spells, nothings serious like Storm of Vengence, but something like create storm in the case of Talos. Basically it's my goal with these type of skills to grant followers of a deity a way to really show off their dedication to their god.

Selveem · Post by **Selveem** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 7:19 pm

It's just an idea, Kirkus. I don't have permission from any Admins to get this information from the other players. They've (obviously) given no nod as to even liking this idea.

As with anything, just be patient. For now, it's just an idea. I would suggest, however, if you have ideas for different faith abilities, that you list them. Preferably one that your own character belongs to, because you'd know that faith best.