Quest Rewards

[Harroghty]

That begins to get complicated. If you are checking for what armor type someone is wearing then what happens if they are wearing more than one type? What if they are wearing three or four types? What if that bandana on your head for style ends up being picked instead of the mail on your body. Or if you were wearing mail and hoping that one day you would get a cool suit of magical plate to replace it?

Better, I think, right now to focus on area code solutions that I can (or another builder can) implement at my level. This is what makeloot can do right now. I cannot make it pick a longsword or pick heavy chain or whathaveyou. Not right now anyway. We can ask Mask for that, but in the short term it's not possible; I can only dictate that it pick a certain category.

Syntax: makeloot <minor|medium*|major*> [armour|weapon|potion|scroll|wondrous|wand|consumable|nonconsumable]

• * These loot types disabled.

I like the exchange idea. What if you gave in two loot weapons (or armor pieces) and received a random one in return?

[Aldren]

I like the idea of an exchange system at any rate (2 for 1, 3 for 1, 5 for 1), anything to help alleviate some of the headaches in getting a bunch of rewards that do a character very little good (either for himself or to trade to others who could put them to use).

All in all, I'm so so so so glad to see these random quest rewards implemented in place of seeing every fighter wearing the same items found in the same areas from the same quests, just because they were the "best" you could find for that class. I think this adds a ton of variety and flavor that the game desperately needed. All of these ideas, I feel, are great ways to move forward and help the game as a whole.

[Calico]

I like the exchange idea. What if you gave in two loot weapons (or armor pieces) and received a random one in return?

The only draw back to that is what if you get something as useless? It sucks that the quests are finite and thus you won't come across alot of stuff people want or need. I like it being random but would there be a way to narrow down the selection maybe when turning it in you can specify a range? Nothing extravagant though!

[Nylo]

I like the exchange idea as well. Yes, there's a limited number of rmi quests, but nobody's forcing you to risk those items in an exchange system. This would also reduce the enormous amount of rmi items that are just sitting in shops, because they are useless to anyone who can actually afford them.

[Selveem]

That begins to get complicated. If you are checking for what armor type someone is wearing then what happens if they are wearing more than one type? What if they are wearing three or four types? What if that bandana on your head for style ends up being picked instead of the mail on your body. Or if you were wearing mail and hoping that one day you would get a cool suit of magical plate to replace it?

That's why I suggested there should be a count. At the time of quest completion, the character's equipped items are examined. To take my Gnome, for instance:

<worn on finger> a gleaming iron ring embossed with a musical note (perfect)
Item color is bright white, not armor.
<worn on finger> a bejeweled ring (perfect)
Item color is bright red, not armor.
<worn around neck> an amulet of communication (perfect)
bright yellow, not armor.
<worn on neck> a blue iron amulet set with an emerald leaf (perfect)
bright blue, not armor.
<worn on body> a platinum-crested steel cuirass (perfect)
bright white, full plate.
<worn on body> a fur rucksack with many pockets (perfect)
dark yellow, not armor.
<worn on feet> bronzed titanium sabatons set with amethysts (perfect)
dark yellow, full plate.
<worn on hands> steel gauntlets emblazoned with a moon and stars (perfect)
bright white, full plate.
<worn on arms> dark green gold-crested steel vambraces (perfect)
dark green, full plate.
<worn about waist> a glistening fauld worked with platinum designs (perfect)
bright yellow, half plate.
<left hand> (Glowing) a small positive energy shard (superb)
bright white, not armor.
<right hand> a pale steel bastard sword with a crimson blade (perfect)
dark white, not armor.
<worn on belt> a gold pocketwatch decorated with cut obsidians (perfect)
bright yellow, not armor.
<worn on belt> a black leather scabbard (perfect)
black, not armor.

The loot reward determined for Shagel ends up being armor. So, the game would run a count on the types of armor he's wearing. For ease, I put that under each line. The count comes out to be:

Full plate: 4
Half plate: 1

So, loot preference for this character would be Full Plate. Then, a count would be done for color:

Bright White: 4
Bright Red: 1
Bright Yellow: 3
Bright Blue: 1
Dark Yellow: 2
Dark Green: 1
Dark White: 1
Black: 1

So, loot color preference for this character would be Bright White.

At this point, the loot system I propose would either generate a completely random armor item or one that is full plate whose color is bright white.

[Nylo]

For a possible addition, if we went with the exchanges, I've been pondering a system similar to one in an rpg I play. Namely, you hand in a certain number of magical items, and in return receive an item that can be used to apply that enchantment to another similar item. Probably between two to five, and limited to rmi armor and weapons for simplicity. You hand the npc two +1 weapons, and in return receive a scroll or something, that you can take to another npc, along with an unenchanted weapon of your choice, which would then become +1. A fee of some sort, or a quest to access it, perhaps. This would of course require a lot of coding - I don't know for certain that code would support it. But this would provide opportunity for a lot of customization.

[Harroghty]

The problem, Selveem, is that what you are proposing is currently impossible without some work from Mask. I cannot accurately estimate the amount of work it would make for him, of course. There is no reliable way to check for colors right now. I could check for armor type, but the program you are suggesting may begin to be too long to work. (Yes, there is a length limit on programs and, yes, I have exceeded it a couple of times.)

Probably the best thing might be to guarantee a type as a result from a more simple input. e.g. you give in two suits of armor and can then ask for a certain type in return. The problem is that the only way to accomplish this is to make a mobile reroll until it gets the armor type that you want; you can't specify the result. It would be a very complex program, but not impossible I think.

What would y'all be willing to give for an upgrade? Two pieces, three pieces? At what point is it no longer attractive?

[Gwain]

Three units for one new reward seems fair. The number is not steep, most new players and old can take advantage of it and if they later abandon the reward it can easily contribute to future exchanges with little regret.

[Anvilin]

It might also give people a reason to start buying all the useless crap in the shops

[Selveem]

Re:Harroghty:
I understand there would be a considerable amount of work involved and concede your point.

It might also give people a reason to start buying all the useless crap in the shops

This is actually what I'm most afraid of. Do you know how easy it would be for a number of my characters to suddenly go out obtaining all those unwanted and discarded quest items that are already saturating the vendor inventories? How fair would that be to all the other players out there?

Instead, I'd suggest a Glory Convert option for it. Don't make it horrible like I've seen in the past, but don't make it too easy, either. Out of my three most-quested characters, I have an average of 153 max glory (one is raising the curve considerably). That's probably going to be the average maximum of most long-term characters. Over the course of their lifetimes, that's about 10 exchanges.

I'd also propose some changes to the current cost of restring+resizing, but that's a conversation for another time I suppose.

In any event, I suppose it's all up for discussion. I don't believe multiple items should be necessary with the inclusion of a glory requirement unless it's to bolster the innate strength of whatever item will be created and/or give you the ability to set the item type that will come out of the exchange.

[Calico]

2 Sounds about right to me

[Harroghty]

Okay. Working on something. More to follow.

[Aldren]

Today, after performing four quests, I received four of the same exact item, just in different colours/styles. That being said, I eagerly await for something to fix the frustration that lies therein.

Cheers.

[Gwain]

I'd also include the ability to create newer and more powerful ioun stones in this system too.

[Vibius]

Perhaps this problem might be addresed with a solution for two different problems: magic equipment can be broken down into magic components (weapons/armor/others) which can be used with new magic item creation feats to create magic items suited to the need of characters. As magic item creation feats require masterwork equipment this would make trades more relevant providing a small decrease in the duration of crafting projects.

[Rhangalas]

Today, after performing four quests, I received four of the same exact item, just in different colours/styles. That being said, I eagerly await for something to fix the frustration that lies therein.

Cheers.

Agreed. For some reason I keep getting greataxes and swords...?

'battleaxe'
'bastard sword'
'rapier'
'greataxe'
'greataxe'

And I have not done many quests by the way.

[Liandria]

So, gambling idea is good, but you still can't determine if the result will be useful, which will deter use considering there are a finite amount of quests with RMI rewards. Is it possible for a program to run a check on the value of the item being turned in, and have that determine an exchange reward?

If possible, could you divide the sell value of the proposed RMI by 10, and give the character a Voucher, redeemable at a nearby plaza? (Yes, I'm sure there's a better name than "voucher") Limit it so that no items under say 30 plat value will be accepted, this will keep people from just chucking every piece of junk they find in to rack up single vouchers. So one of those +1 Masterwork Greatswords going for 120 plat at Saern's would get you 6 vouchers, because it only actually sold to Saern for 60ish).

Then have a couple of plazas where the character can exchange those vouchers for different things, similar to the custom colored robe shops. Such as 20 vouchers (roughly 400 plat if you bought from a vendor, 200 if you completed the quests yourself) for a masterwork Magical Fullplate Breastplate. Maybe 10 for the halfplate. 12 for Fullplate legging and scaled down the line for quality and type of armor. I'm not real sure what is a reasonable price, this is just a crude idea for explanation sake, all these numbers are just placeholders so I can explain my thoughts.

There's a number of ways this could be explained IC'ly. Perhaps someone stole something rare and dangerous in the magical community, without knowing its real power, and all the factions are scrambling trying to figure out where it is now. Without letting the populace know exactly what they are looking for they start drives for people to turn in magical artifacts and use this to sift through them. It also lets them stockpile 2-5 pieces of equipment for every 1 they turn back out. Mystrans would be tucking it into vaults, probably, Zhents painting it black with skulls and putting it on their officers, and who knows what the Lords of Westgate would be doing with it.

[Rhangalas]

Why not have it just check the PC's class and generate something appropriate?

[Liandria]

Why not have it just check the PC's class and generate something appropriate?

I don't see why that couldn't be added in, and I'm for that! Getting items that have a better chance of being useful is a good thing. It might lessen the problem but I don't think it would be enough to deal with the entire issue. There's a huge surplus of RMI quest rewards, and more will continue to be generated.

Even if the game did determine the RMI based on your class there's a good chance of getting similar items or items that are inferior to what you already possess. That still lands a large amount of rewards going right back to the vendors. A priest that keeps getting +1 maces, is just going to keep the one that looks the best, maybe a 2nd on his mount, and vendor the rest. That's assuming he doesn't vendor them all, because he found a +2 flail somewhere.

Similarly with armor there's a good chance of getting pieces that all serve the same purpose. You don't need 3 +1 breastplates, and four pairs of +1 gauntlets when you are still using junk chain boots, so you dump the duplicates in the NPC store and buy what you are missing. Now there's a bunch more items in the shop, and only 1 purchased. This contributes to that massive surplus of weapons and gear being offloaded to NPCs and just sitting there in a 300+ item list.

[Kinni]

I love the idea of trading two items in for one. Even if you get something back you don't want, it should be one less thing to cart around and hopefully be an item more sellable to PCs.

I think the issue, currently, is the abundance of RMIs that aren't useless to anyone. When is the last time you've seen a character using a nunchaku or kama or wands or scrolls? And, by a show of hands, how many of you commonly get these aforementioned pieces as RMI? This is what's filling up the store. Playing a merchant character, I don't mind hold on to the enchanted staff until a newbie PC wizard comes along and needs to buy it. But, a nunchaku? I'm selling that puppy and adding to the spam of the local shops. I do my best to hold onto everything for possible PC sale/trade/interaction, but even I have my limits.

Let's make the system at least consider the playerbase. Focus on what's important to the coded characters: wizards, fighters, rogues, druids. Gear the reward towards the nature of the quest. For example: this is a druid-ish quest, lets give out some enchanted leather something-or-other!

Edit to elaborate: Currently I understand that the reward is sent to a small/med/large basis, right? What if the druid quest was set to code something like: Reward = <vnum 123 or vnum 125 or vnum 128>, these vnums reflecting something appropriate to druidic nature. It makes more sense ICly for the druid NPC to have an item like this, anyway. After that, the code could: restring reward <random color code/description here>. This is a rough idea since I'm taking my understanding of MUSH code and trying to make if fit, but there you have it.

There is definitely some tweaking called for in the current RMI process to avoid flooding the market/server with useless items in stores. But, in the interim, the trade process sounds fantastic!