Backstab - Shouldn't stack

[Ungtar]

STR 8/18 Bonus: -1

Affected: Backstab for a long time

This effect seems to have started stacking. I don't remember it doing so before. A problem when fighting multiple thief mobs who spam it.

[Ungtar]

Even worse ... they don't wear off together. I waited over an hour for the first one to wear off and then the next one starts up again:

Affected: Backstab for a long time

[Zorinar]

The effect lasts a long time, as it is supposed to. It does wear off.
I have never seen the effect stack.

[Althasizor]

It is supposed to 'stack' like that. It's the equivalent of a rogue Special Ability in the SRD that reads:

An opponent damaged by one of her sneak attacks also takes 2 points of Strength damage. Ability points lost to damage return on their own at the rate of 1 point per day for each damaged ability.

There's no cap or cooldown on receiving ability damage. It'd actually make it pretty useless in 90% of cases if it could only ever take off 2 strength.

[Ungtar]

It stacked me all the way down to 4 strength. Even my spellpouch was too heavy to walk with. I had to recall out and sit in one room for over an hour and a half.

Pretty excessive considering a thief mob can stack it on you 3-4 times in a single fight.

[Althasizor]

Yes, ability damage is something you'll want to look out for. Getting hit with enervation is even less fun.

[Yemin]

I remember talk about bandages being able to remove backstab's effects, or was that only an unimplemented suggestion?

[Alitar]

I think it was not implemented. Does backstab leave a 'glance' entry? I've never checked but I think it should. Something like, "$n has been hamstringed!" Or "$n has a deep wound in their back."

[Yemin]

Currently, it doesn't I believe.

[Althasizor]

I don't -think- the bandaging was implemented, but that discussion was about the bleed caused by arterial strike, not crippling strike's ability damage. Still a good suggestion though!

[Woror]

It should stack, crippling strike causes attribute damage, which is stackable, but restoration should remove it.

[Beskytter]

'Sneak' is the key word here though.
You can't use a sneak attack on a character that knows you're fighting with them and sneak attacks are only allowed when a target is considered flatfooted (No Dex bonus to AC). I don't know that circle stab should be able to initiate a crippling strike so easily, if at all, but perhaps along the same lines as undead sucking levels away this too should be something covered by a healer spell.
If this ability damage is able to stack, fighters should be granted a feat to add natural fortification to their worn armor to make them less susceptible to sneak attack damage.

Light fortification, medium fortification, and heavy fortification were designed specifically with this in mind... to thwart sneak attack damage that could be done by a rogue. (LF= 25%, MF= 50%, HF= 75%) I've not found any fortification items in game and I don't see any help files that talk about it.

[dolifer]

I don't mean to get off topic... But here's as good a place as any, I think.

Another suggestion I would propose regarding this... If possible, make it unable to be dispelled with magic. As it is, I'm able to use dispel magic or break enchantment to get rid of this effect, and I'm fairly certain that shouldn't be the case.

[Alitar]

I would say to fix that after implementing a proper fix. Heal and restoration should fix it but neither work to my knowledge.

[Althasizor]

'Sneak' is the key word here though.
You can't use a sneak attack on a character that knows you're fighting with them and sneak attacks are only allowed when a target is considered flatfooted (No Dex bonus to AC)

Not quite. Sneak attack also applies in tabletop anytime you flank an opponent.

The rogue’s attack deals extra damage any time her target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether the target actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), or when the rogue flanks her target.

I've always thought circle stab was meant to emulate the effects of 'flanking' in tabletop, a sort of work-around for our lack of grid movement. To even activate, your target has to be aggro on someone else. Success at it is even based on its own skill in FK, so harder!

I can only agree with the others though, dispel magic/break enchantment should probably be switched out for heal/restoration for this.

[Yemin]

Apart from initiative and circle stab. Rogues on here also get it whenever the opponents blinded / stunned. which happens alot... take a cleric/wizard with you/ dirtkick/gouge

Also, Is it considered code / bug abuse to be dispelling backstab? I remember it being mentioned before and since after maybe half a year its still there I just let it go

[Ungtar]

Currently it can't be dispelled or healed and a mob can do it to you every single round, stacking 5-8 of them on you in a single fight with no apparent means of mitigation or avoidance.

I'm only talking about PVE here, not PVP.

In my opinion, any game mechanic which prevents you from playing the game for an hour or more is a bad mechanic.

[Ungtar]

Currently it can't be dispelled or healed and a mob can do it to you every single round, stacking 5-8 of them on you in a single fight with no apparent means of mitigation or avoidance.

I'm only talking about PVE here, not PVP.

In my opinion, any game mechanic which prevents you from playing the game for an hour or more is a bad mechanic.

[Gwain]

Maybe limit the ability to pc thieves and remove the ability from thief mobiles to avoid issues like being marooned in areas unable to move.

[Yemin]

Isn't the problem the duration? Why not just make it short to very short duration. Its not a skill thats going to benefit the thief outside of combat anyway.