The FK Nooby Experience So Far

[Oghma]

I'd like to go back to piercing/slashing damage for only mobiles armed with slashing or piercing weapons. Or to only allow it on mobiles with piercing and slashing natural weapons like pincers or razored claws.

[Selveem]

Damage type is easily set by race (and though I've never built in a SMAUG before, I know you can set damage type overrides in many of the other MUDs I have played on/built for).

I agree with Oghma. I also think those little dummies should only be able to stun at the worst. Honestly, I'd go as far as to say they shouldn't even fight back because they're _DUMMIES_ but that's just me being obvious about the matter.

Is it possible to set killmode default on the mob level? Like spawn it only with killmode stun set?

[Pyranis]

Since I died again and lost my gear and couldn't afford a mace, I found that not using a weapon has made everything 100% easier. Brawling does a ton more damage and doesn't seem to take nearly as much movement as my mace was. I just went from 0-50% exp in less than 30 minutes, a definite upgrade from the few hours it was taking in the temple. Woo!

[Zorinar]

Hello, I would like to add my comments here since I am one of those rare totally new players to this mud. This might be a long post...

My initial experience was rather frustrating and sad. I started with a priest. Perhaps not the best choice for a first time player on this mud but straight out fighters have just never been my thing. I read through the help files extensively and understood that I was going to have to work through a PC player base of church goers in order to be "faithed."

However, my problem was that there was a lack of church leadership, which retarded my ability to get faithed. In fact, it never happened. As an unfaithed priest, I didnt have access to any decent defensive spells, not even bless in my case. Being not faithed, I had no access to better spells that required you be faithed before the teachers would teach. I could heal up to serious, create food and water and some other basic spells. I made it up to about level 25 without any real spells that would help me get by in a fight. I had two attacks per round and couldn't afford more than chain mail. I got to the point where I could handle the bandits and travel the roads, but most bigger things killed me right off. The problem was two-fold.

1) I wasn't strong enough to handle a lot of things alone. I couldn't survive the howling peaks alone, for example.

2) I couldnt find people to adventure with. I had to solo. I was in that transition where I was not a weak newbie but I wasnt strong enough to be useful to anyone yet.

As you can see, #1 and #2 become a positive feed back loop. Perhaps an experienced player could have worked though this, knowing where to go, what quests handed out the most money, how to get great equipment and even just by knowing who to ask to get the help they needed. However, most of the players are established here and they have their crowds to hang out with. I played my character as friendly and nice to everyone, but yet I never was able to find people to adventure with. Oh sure a few times I was helped here and there, but overall I was playing solo, and as an unfaithed priest at that. I was just impossible and I gave it up.

So I made a wizard, and it was hard. I absolutely needed help, and I still do need help. Help isnt always available, and most of the time my wizard has to practice spells on dummies. About 75% of the time I would say. And I cant even practice on the hard dummies or they beat me up pretty badly and ruin my limbs in a few seconds. What helped me this time around was that I injected myself into a group of characters and just nagged them to death for help at times. I hated doing that, but it was the only way to get some things done.

My suggestions are the following:
Create a few more transitional zones where characters in the 15-30 range can solo.

Create more class oriented zones. Most of them seem to be based on a fighter's level. Howling peaks is a good example. I have seen level 12 fighters go through that place without much need for help. I, as a mid twenty something wizard cannot. A wizard is different and needs to play with a different dynamic. Priests are also vulnerable but in different ways. Perhaps some zones that can cater to the class dynamic would be helpful to new players. New players that are not getting much help should still be able to enjoy themselves regardless of what class they are. Sometimes you just dont want to sit in the square and listen to people squabble, you actually want to do something.

I think the player base here is great, friendly and helpful. But they have their own things to do and dont want to be constantly feeding newbies equipment, help, money or advice. The newbies need a place where they can accumulate money, experience and perhaps a tad better access to spells and components. I am not saying newbies need a zone where they can power level, but a zone that gives them something to do. If such a place exists for them, even I dont know about it now. And if I dont know about it, they certainly dont.

The end:)

[Selveem]

However, my problem was that there was a lack of church leadership, which retarded my ability to get faithed. In fact, it never happened. As an unfaithed priest, I didnt have access to any decent defensive spells, not even bless in my case. Being not faithed, I had no access to better spells that required you be faithed before the teachers would teach. I could heal up to serious, create food and water and some other basic spells. I made it up to about level 25 without any real spells that would help me get by in a fight. I had two attacks per round and couldn't afford more than chain mail. I got to the point where I could handle the bandits and travel the roads, but most bigger things killed me right off. The problem was two-fold.

As being a member of a faith that lacks a Faith Manager, I can completely understand your frustration. But, I would like you to know your frustration is not just yours alone, but those who want to help you and are unable.

Perhaps an experienced player could have worked though this, knowing where to go, what quests handed out the most money, how to get great equipment and even just by knowing who to ask to get the help they needed.

You're right, in some ways, I did. When I made my newbie Priest of Moradin, understanding what will pwn the hell out of me and how to level, react, and knowing when it's alright to flee were very important survival skills that I utilized without even thinking about it. A newer player would definitely not have that advantage.

However, most of the players are established here and they have their crowds to hang out with. I played my character as friendly and nice to everyone, but yet I never was able to find people to adventure with.

Actually, this was the reason that I made a Dwarf in MH. Even if I did have temptation to tell someone about my character, they'd not be able to help me. In truth, I didn't get any help leveling until I could pretty much do it on my own. I actually grouped with you for a level or two. The remainder grouping time was spent with another player in your original exact predicament: unfaithed priest. And yes, it is hard on her. Very frustrating for her at times I would assume, but she keeps plugging away at it like a champ.

My suggestions are the following:
Create a few more transitional zones where characters in the 15-30 range can solo.

I agree with this. I've pretty much already got one built, but it's a 121 vnum area already and since I'm not a builder, my first submission has to be a 50 vnum area, so I have to make one of those and finish it before I can finish the one I already almost completed.

Create more class oriented zones. Most of them seem to be based on a fighter's level. Howling peaks is a good example. I have seen level 12 fighters go through that place without much need for help. I, as a mid twenty something wizard cannot.

Actually, most areas are easier for wizards than fighters. It's all in knowing where to find them, which unfortunately, only comes with experience. And Priests have two areas that they just decimate off the top of my head which enable them to level at a very decent rate.

Sometimes you just dont want to sit in the square and listen to people squabble, you actually want to do something.

Most of the good RPs I have been in were when Waterdeep's rules were far more lax. Honestly, now with the laws and how people take advantage of them, I find most of the RPs are a bit lame and things that happen in the square often make absolutely no sense at all anymore.

I think the player base here is great, friendly and helpful. But they have their own things to do and dont want to be constantly feeding newbies equipment, help, money or advice.

I suppose this depends on the player, but there are many of the player base who don't mind at all offering assistance. To many of us, we actually enjoy seeing players actually achieve their goals. Whether it's to become a success full ally or enemy.

The newbies need a place where they can accumulate money, experience and perhaps a tad better access to spells and components.

I don't think this is just a newbie problem.. My old character, Selveem, has been saving up for a loooong time trying to afford the housing (500 plat per room, 2 room minimum). The only ways that it is relatively easy/safe to earn coin wouldn't be tolerated by much of the staff.

That being said, if any new characters ever need advice or help, they may feel free to PM me or utilize my contact information is listed for AIM.

[Nysan]

Since I died again and lost my gear and couldn't afford a mace, I found that not using a weapon has made everything 100% easier. Brawling does a ton more damage and doesn't seem to take nearly as much movement as my mace was. I just went from 0-50% exp in less than 30 minutes, a definite upgrade from the few hours it was taking in the temple. Woo!

Noticed this as well. Recently started a tiefling and the leveling was slow with his weapon of choice. Took the weapon off and went the brawling route. Was dropping dummies at least 3 times as fast than with the starter weapons and exp was flowing in. Does brawling have higher damage modifiers than the plain starter weapons, so it grants more exp?

[Horace]

you just automatically get three attacks with brawling, there is no reason to use a weapon until you get third attack (unless your STR is low)

[Pyranis]

Random high five for figuring this out before I climbed a tower with a rifle! O/\O

[Selveem]

I was talking on messenger with Garumsh after an incident where a friend of his was one-shot by a human slave.

I know PC vs PC, you can't take a head off even with a critical (caveat: that _I_ have ever seen) in code and it got me wondering if there is different combat code for mobs than there is for players?

Either way, I was hoping one of the builders/coders (whichever group it pertains to) could have a look at it.

From what I understand, melee without a weapon (as a Human) should only do subdual damage. Further, the only time it should critical is on a natural 20 (if it was a critical). Even then, base damage on a melee strike without special feats is only 1d3 hp damage with a fist as a fist is considered a 'tiny' weapon.

He wasn't able to access forums at the time, so I was typing this up for him, but he can already now so he might be able to provide more clarity if needed.

[Xryon]

Selveem pretty much covered it. But it's not just limited to newbies, which is the most infuriating.. I know it has happened to me on several occasions, and I am not at all a low level.
I have to ask: How many people can knock someone's head off with a punch?(I assume that is what is happening with the insta-death-critical-punch of doom)
Unless a kung-fu master was captured and bound, I do not think they would just.. Know any death strikes.
I seem to be noticing a great number of problems with combat, of late, though this seems to be the only one I can offer a possible solution to; doesn't even require a whole lot of coding, I would think:
Remove the head from being a target for critical hits.
As far as I know, The head is the only body part that you can be killed instantly from here.. So if we remove that, a great many problems would be fixed.
I am sorry if this is somewhat incoherent; I've been awake for a little over twenty-four hours now. If more clarification is needed, I will be happy to do so as questions are asked.

[Nysan]

Definately agree on the head-crit concern. Makes little sense considering some of the mobs that seem to be doing this. Dragons and the like, I get it and it makes sense. Training dummy... leads back to the "dummies should be killmode:stun" point before, practice areas shouldn't have a body count.

Reminds me of a similar newbie (and non-newbie) head-scratcher I encountered recently... How do you pay an NPC priest to regenerate a limb when your coins are in your bag and you have lost both your arms. "Get a friend" answer not valid, mind you, considering limited friends of newbies and limited friends some characters have by design (racial, faith, whatever). Its a thinker! hehehe

[Selveem]

I don't know if anything's been changed yet for newbie areas, but I thought I'd share this with you all:

A medium green beetle grunts as your kick lands.
a medium green beetle is badly injured.
You cannot do that while recovering from physical exertion!
A medium green beetle's bite impales you.
That really did HURT!

That "really did hurt!" took me from 100%hp at level 1 to 30%hp.

I know Dwarves in Mithril Halls are supposed to have it a bit tougher, but for a newbie area.. ow.

[Nedylene]

Same exact thing in Skullport newbie area

[Horace]

Any creature that has the "impale" attack is nuts.

[Nysan]

Any creature that has the "impale" attack is nuts.

So true. I know Skullport and MH are 'difficult' hometowns, but one shotted by newbie area mobs makes me chuckle.

[Nedylene]

Any creature that has the "impale" attack is nuts.

So true. I know Skullport and MH are 'difficult' hometowns, but one shotted by newbie area mobs makes me chuckle.

One shotted is... Beyond ouch. I like these two towns but I hate to say it, some of the more active hometowns need help. I have discovered while experimenting is that dummies seem to be the problem with exp gain. The RACE dummies. ZK temple has humans, elves, halflings etc... I can get up to level tel in less then 10 hours. Try it. If all you do is grind you can be in and out in no time. Every other place though.... You would spend over 20-30 getting to level 10 because they are dummies. Skullport I do find the exp goes quicker. Again though.. No dummies. Not as quick as ZK

[Nysan]

Thats definately true. Just like weapons compared to brawling at low levels, dummies are are the low side of the exp per kill scale compared to say... Mithril Hall beetles.

[Selveem]

Those using brawling to level at low levels as opposed to using weapons will be suffering a rude awakening when they find that brawling has changed.

That being said, I haven't noticed a real difference aside from dummies (and everything else that matter) able to hit like a truck starting out. Even the dummies in WD. Sometimes, I get hit for 5% my health (starting with the most con possible for a human), other times it can be 20%. Dunno if it gets higher. I didn't pay attention otherwise. Most of the time it hovers around 10%. Very painful.

Agreed, the beetle did far more with that 70% hit.

[Alvirin]

Mind that a low levels you have really low hp, a cleric of level 1 would have a hp of 8+con modifier, and a punch/attack/claw might remove (1d3 or 1d4)+strength modifier, is the way it is in D&D, some classes have struggling beginnings and a lucky level 1kobold might kill you if he rolls a critical, but unlike in D&D you have 3 extra lives until you reach level 10 which makes you less suceptible to such lucky rolls.

[Selveem]

Indeed, the difference is that in D&D your DM is generally not going to just go cutting you down at level 1.

I'm not saying melee attacks should not be devastating. Indeed, they REALLY should be. Even more so than they are currently.

I would agree with you that technically speaking a level one would get rocked pretty hard by even an animated dummy (perhaps to death), but we're talking in a newbie area.

In all honesty, these dummies shouldn't even be fighting back. I may be mistaken, but from what I understand we don't want people getting discouraged even before they adventure out of the temple and get to _really_ roleplay with others.