Instead

[Bregga]

of weakening different classes/races to make the game even why not strengthen the rest? Every time something is taken out of the game or changed for the worse it makes the game weaker and is only going to draw people away from it. I know I'm not the only one thinking this, it shows in the number of players online lately. I'm not trying to criticize anyone but I do think that there is a better way to make the game even and fun for everyone.

[Gwain]

It could be a correlation of a number of things unrelated to the mud.

Video games for one lure people away from text based games.
The time of the year: everyone is either incredibly busy or enjoying/despising the weather

The mud is constantly evolving and as such is never finished. Its possible that one change accomplished now will be beneficial later. I'm reminded of the incorporation of racial attacks and abilities, which made the mud difficult at first, but when finished and implemented for player character races, turned out to be quite beneficial.

Change keeps things interesting, for better or for worse, we need to progress with difficulties or risk stagnating and gaining nothing from it. If you can level a character to fifty in one day then in a month you will have nothing to do. That's a broad statement, but it fits with improvement in reference to the mud. Challenge is not a deterrent.

Things that are bad or broken do get weeded out. A few years ago a function was added to the mud where mobiles would pick up your weapons and wield them when they disarmed you. The problem being that they would use it as a gm'd weapon skill and the weapon would be junked in short order. This was fixed quickly.

Not to deride your concerns. You have a right to your opinion. I just want to show that things are in constant flux, they change and get worked out. They just take time.

[Xryon]

I'm going to add my agreement with Bregga, even though I know I've been gone for a while.

I've been playing here for a long, long time now, and I've commented on it before. Making things more difficult does not equal making things more fun. I've seen a lot of changes since I've been here; some good, some not so much. I can remember a level 50 fighter being able to hold his own.. Now? Garumsh can hardly go anywhere. That's a change that happened quite a long time ago, and hasn't been rectified.

I don't want to bitch, because I've been here a long time, and I've enjoyed it for the most part. It's just not any fun when things change, dificulties increase, and suddenly you can't do anything without a small army.

[Eltsac]

I haven't played for a while, but then, 10 years ago, the discussions were already the same...
The thing is that the mud has always been coded so that people need to be in a group (at least 2 or 3) to do something.
And it's not only the game... D'nD has always been this way (though with paper and dice a group is about 5, but then in the mud it better to require less to be able to gather a group more easily)
Having a class being able to clear areas of its level on his own has always been considered as being too powerful.

With years passing, more and more people would like to be able to play and advance on their own, I don't know if it's some sort of modern way of life.

I know it's not always easy to find a group to do something, but if it wasn't coded that way, you would have most player playing everyone on his own ... removing most of the interest of the mud...

my point

El & co

[Brar]

Well, as one who just came back my opinion is quite different.
I don't trust in powering the rest because one is more powerful than others. It only ends in everyone is all powerfull.
In a game, balance is far more tricky than just buffing the weakest one.
I don't think you are suppose to see all the game by yourself, even at level 50. No class should be actually, it is a multiplayer game and thus should be played with others, in groups. Yes there can be some solo areas, but for me they should be mob rampaging zone and contains zero reward (not even xp, nothing, just bashing mobs for the sake of bashing mobs) and be utterly not fun.
You want big rewards and challenge and fun, then find a group, mount an expedition and have fun togethers.
I think it is a question that came with the discovery of solo mmorpg "Everquest, Wow, ..." where they have to put soloable content to keep customer as they need money but I plainly hated it, it was far more rewarding to gather 200 peoples in Lineage to down a dragon than gathering 5 guys in WoW to clean all the dungeon in the game without dying (and yes, I played all MMo to date as a stage or the others beginning with MUD2 very long ago).
For me the essence of the game is to group, now to be honest, the melrose place square rp get on my nerves very quickly and I far prefer to rp dungeon delving than second life but then I will try to find a small group (3 is far from enough) and just comes out with a made up reason to go bashing mob in group, exploring a forest, discovering a wilderness zone until we all get the knowledge geography out of it (can takes long time if unlucky) and not rushing the area until you get it, but rping the discover of the wild life, the different earth types, the trees, ect even what is not actually coded. That's what rp is about for me.

Now, if everybody would be uber powerful and I can solo about everything in the game then let's be honest, I quit fair and square. And I think that if someone think he should solo go in any area of his level alone and carelessly then he should perhaps find another game (or should I ?).
Another point, I notice the main ones to complain (yes I call that a complain) are warriors. Do you take potions? protections? because an adventurer going out without some sort of healing is called for me a fool (and don't argue about the shop price, with very little PC interaction you can get healing and buff potions quite easily for virtualy free).

You say your level 50 fighter can hardly go anywhere, perhaps you should make a list of the place you can not go and compare it to the actual list of areas in the game... and tell us the percentage. Now if you call going there, just walking from rooms to rooms to bash mobs without any healing backup, tactics, pulling or such then I can do nothing but feel sorry for you.

The ECL is something rather fun actually, yes you wil have a harder time leveling up, and what? leveling up is your whole point in the game? Then I wonder why you even play this game and not some hack and slash muds....
I mean there is some character under level ten that became legends, and that should be it is a RP mud, not a BASH'em up mud.

For one, I like the changes that was made since I left, the games is far harder in term of fight than it was ten years ago, but it is so much more rewarding, I just in joy when I stumble upon 2 hill giant and not having to flee because of the good decision I took, I find it thrilling and just makes me craves for more.

As a last statement, I want to point out that it is my personnal opinion and I plainly assume it. I may sounds harsh, but I simply hate whininng when something is made harder and more challenging, if it is how it should be then so be it, it should have been this way already, I don't think any of the recent changes were made just for fun, and they all brings something to the game in my eyes (or states clearly what you are against instead of staying in the vague, facts are better than assumption).

Brar, in one of his big day

PS: Just to clarify things, I had to stopped ten years ago for the good of the mud, not my own will and never stopped keeping informed about it and all the changes from a very reliable source (so no one comes with a "oh but you have not seen all the changes yet" which I got a few days ago)

[Briek]

Okay, a short list of (what I believe to be) truths

Fact: Some classes are overpowered

Fact: fighters aren't too weak to go anywhere

Fact: Detol protects against 99.9% of bacteria

Fact: Encouraging grouping always enriches roleplay even if it is just a stroll around the city (we all group for events besides adventuring!)

I will give only my honest opinion here that I believe this post mainly refers to the toning down of many of the more exotic races in the game and I don't that was a bad thing...

I think after the loss of the glory conversion system, people started searching for more stat points elsewhere (I won't say I haven't) the answer was monsterous races (in my opinion) for many. So the very idea was to make balance of races by introducing this stuff.

IF you want to you can have a powerful character on FK, it just takes time but this from personal experience I believe that when you work long and hard for that gain you are always looking for another gain and another one which is the basis behind this debate I think. I am sure it's a justified argument but like Gwain says it's one I don't think will EVER be solved. The game has changed quite a bit recently now it really depends on you as to if you think it's good or bad I personally think for the most part it's been good.

Personally I don't feel like there has been a solid argument so far to revert any of the changes made.

*EDIT* some of the mobs seem a little unbalanced, this is a change I'd like to see

thanks for reading

[Hrosskell]

Edited to remove a rant that wasn't necessary.

I do not think the low amount of active players has anything to do with class/race balance.
I do think that it will be okay.

[Nysan]

For the moment, my only real concern is the balance of certain mobs. And that, as always, is a work in progress.

I have played most classes over the years. Tweaks and changes are always needed, but I never logged into a character and got a feeling of hopelessness or anything. Sure, Gilain cannot solo 3 wyverns at a time and Nysan cannot heal through big red's fire breathing anymore. Thats not exactly a bad thing though.

[Mele]

Please refer to: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=10059 before you post a thread like this.


I'd like to assure people that by no means were changes made to 'make things less powerful' or to ruin anyones fun time.

The numbers often go down come the months of June, July and August. Students are no longer in dorm rooms, or stuck home every night with the cloud of school the next morning looming over their heads. Families are taking vacations and students are working and out more. There has never been a year in my nine-ish on FK where the summer has not been quiet.

[Skeas]

Do remember that in a D&D campaign, dates are set between x amount of people to do y activity. Why does everything have to be so spontaneous? Talk to a group of people who log at similar times and PLAN to do something! It'll be fun. WoW raids are planned weeks/months in advance, you know?

[Nysan]

WoW raids... the horror, the unspeakable horror.

Still, a valid point. Make friends and figure out when who logs in. It works when events and teaching sessions are planned. No reason you can't have a brief OOC discussion on whats the best time for an Undermountain run or something.