Craft Q&A

[Nysan]

Not my decision, so I'll just stick with opinions. I always thought all kinds of shields should be metal and wood crafts. I have personally seen wood and metal small shield, medium shields, and tower shields IRL at festivals and in a few movies. I would say bucklers too, but I am a bit fuzzy on what defines a buckler vs a small shield, so not sure what the ones I seen IRL are technically.

The question becomes time vs reward. Construct is annoying, confusing code. Is it worth the effort/time to adjust shield materials? Or are there enough in-game options to make the reward not worth the hassle? Seriously, I'm asking folks... is it worth it?

[Athon]

Gilain,

I think we're still in a bit of a shield limbo in FK. The new changes have helped a bit but I feel it's really difficult to notice what effect shields still play in combat. Granted, I haven't thrown on a tower shield since the coding changes.

Personally, I like having the option available to me as a smith. I've seen a few PC-made shields around, so I'm sure they're good quality. I reckon the same logic would apply to PC-made tower shields. I only know of a few tower shields in-game and they are all average quality or so. I would say that PC-made tower shields, with the ability to make them of outstanding/superior quality would likely be worth it in the current setting of the game.

[Nysan]

Gilain used a tower shield for a week and a heavy shield for a week, after the change. I was curious and I like to understand most defensive options. I definately would suggest either for most characters. *shrug*

Not sure how PC crafts would be better, besides less repairing. Helpfiles state the tower shield bonus is +4 armor (and the dex/hitroll mods). Would PC crafts be able to improve on that? +5? Or is it a set value, unchanged by shield quality? I just don't know.

[Athon]

I guess I need to throw them on, then, and re-evaluate my assessment on shields.

And I have no idea how the coding on armour/shields work behind the scenes. Technically speaking, in D20 there is only masterwork and nonmasterwork armour. In FK, we have more variables (compare inferior armour vs superior armour) thrown in to make the game more fun. I reckon the same would apply to shields, but I don't know to any degree of certainty.

[Nysan]

That being said, Gilain, I do have a question: About how long is the entire process to produce a full piece of MW armor (or have you done it yet?)

Already posted on this, but I decided to offer a little more insight. I just started a full plate project, not MW, but a good marker to guess from. High-grade steel, full plate takes 10 weeks and costs 21 platinum, 3 gold to make per piece. So, assume a 1-3 week mark up for MW and a cost increase. Best guess... 11-13 weeks and 25-30 platinum for fees per piece of MW full plate. Full suit: 77 to 91 weeks (no failures) and 175+ platinum in fees (no failures).

In other words, the days of 100 platinum armor suits is over and don't even ask for full suits of MW armor... you couldn't afford it.

Quoting myself, so sad.

Just a quick follow up on this. A masterwork steel full plate cuirass (breastplate) costed me 28 platinum, 4 gold and a starting time of 10 weeks, though I expect a few delays from failures so closer to 15 maybe by the time its done. Best guess, chest pieces are the most expensive pieces of the set. Hope this was helpful.

[Nysan]

Oh, it has been a few days since ingot smelting was added. Besides a few quality bugs, which are being dealt with, I think it is going well. But, I am curious about everyone else. Anyone still having problems with surplus metals or unwanted qualities? Or has this change solved all those problems?

[Athon]

Smelting ingots together seems like a gamble to me. I only do it on my low quality ingots because if I do it on average or higher, I still get a return of 50%+ of low-quality ingots. I don't like sacrificing two average/high ingots to get a single low-quality ingot.

It has helped with the low-quality ingots, however, since I'm able to turn them into average ingots about half the time.

I still find the hardest issue is getting enough of the same quality of ingot to start an armoursmithing craft. I personally still think the range of ingots generated is too wide for a GM. I'd like to see a range of 2-3 qualities of mining/smelting per skill level. Example:

Inept miner: worthless, inferior, low
Journeyman miner: low, average, high,
GM: high, superior, oustanding

I think that will make it a bit easier to obtain 10 pieces of the same quality for all levels as well as provide a smooth transition to level up.

[Nysan]

Back for round... well, whatever number this post is,

First, comment on Athon's post. Thats not my experience. I resmelt metal of average or below quality and only use higher tier metals for my armors (steel, iron, titanium, ect). That leaves 3 qualities for my crafts and I always seem to have enough metal around for Gilain's projects, even with feeding his lapidary addiction. Not saying you are doing anything wrong. This is merely my experience.

Anyone else having issues gathering enough same quality metals? Please do not complain about outstanding quality, thats supposed to be hard to get.

Second reason for this post, player feedback survey. New mining system has been up and running long enough for our mining community to build opinions.

Simple question: Locating ore, happy with the current system? (ore nodes that run out periodically, rarer metals in high level areas) If not, why? Details!!!

[Maybel]

i sent in a complaint, but as this just came up...

As a NEW miner, i am having quite a lot of difficulty (like impossible the last 4-6 nights) getting anything, I have tried all the new areas to mine and have yet to mine anything, sure i get echoes that I find something but can't mine it due to my level, but other then that, I have yet to find anything sense I learned the trade (and that is not without many hours of trying to mine). No one knows anything so I have come to think the new system is broken for fresh new miners

[Lathlain]

That I'm able to establish, this is how the current mining system works:

+ A miner enters a mineable area and uses the mine command.
This uses the miner's skill to search for a fresh vein of ore, and then generates one based on the maximum ore type that can be found in the area (some areas will only host copper and tin, while others might have iron and mithril for instance), and the skill of the miner. A low level miner won't find a gold vein, for example.

+ Once a vein appears, it designates that particular substance as the mineable resource in the area.
Any subsequent use of the mine command, whether by the original miner or not, and even in different rooms of the same area, will attempt to mine from the newly discovered vein.

+ When the vein is exhausted, no ore is designated for the area and subsequent mine attempts will instead attempt to search for a new vein.

The obvious negative side effect to this is that an experienced miner mining in a 'low level' mine may potentially create high level veins that new miners aren't able to interact with. For what it's worth - the previous system was similar, but the vein never exhausted! *shudder*

So there's your dilemma. How would you propose we reach a compromise that you think is fairer? Is it better to flag certain pre-designated low level mines so as not to create unfriendly high level veins in places where new miners are likely to go, or would you rather re-address the entire system? Constructive feedback is always appreciated!

[Maybel]

+ Once a vein appears, it designates that particular substance as the mineable resource in the area.
Any subsequent use of the mine command, whether by the original miner or not, and even in different rooms of the same area, will attempt to mine from the newly discovered vein.

I like the new system, seams much better then someone tapping at the same room in the same place for hours on end. Tho if they do not find the mineral they are looking for, they will not mine it out (or might not) leaving that area with a higher level ore that the lower level miners can not mine...

The problem is in the bold. The vein should stay in that room, or should despawn after so many hours. Not in that whole area (as there are not that many areas that low levels can go to level new mining)

I do not know what resets these veins or if they reset, but I have mined even after a soft reset and came up with nothing as well

[Nysan]

If you are mining right after a copyover and still not getting something in your range, that sounds off. All mining is reset with copyovers (I think), so unless there is a speedy character darting around ahead of you... something is wrong there.

As for the higher ups setting areas... Much better than the last system, obviously. Maybe we should hard set certain areas to only copper-tin-lead? With shifting nodes in, its not as hard for experienced miners to stay in a higher level area and work it til the proper node pops out. Also, most experienced miners know and can access more than 1 area to mine, while younger miners may only have access to 1 or 2 areas.

I suggest the Peaks for the practice area.

[Maybel]

With this new system, if I "Find an ore that I realize is beyond my skill to retrieve." Does that mean it is pointless to keep trying mine in that area because all the ore in that area is going to be the same until it is mined out?

Maybe the trouble is I am finding ore that is out of my level and it sets all the ore in that area as that ore type until it is mined out... and I am just having super bad luck trying to mine and finding ore I cannot mine and it is stuck on that ore type tell someone can mine it

[Nysan]

Hard to say what is going on with your miner, without seeing it first hand.

I'll try and get some time in on one of my lower level miners and do some testing. Far as I know, "beyond my skill level to retrieve" stays until it is mined out, that echo does not take away from the node like 'failed to extract' or a successful mine. Not 100% on that, I'll see what I can find during testing.

Still think hardcode an area to copper-tin-lead only will fix this issue. Experienced miners don't need to run around as much in the new system, just have to clear out a node and try again. So there is no real impact to them if one area is coded as a 'practice metal only' zone. It would have a large impact on newbie miners trying to get on their feet.

[Maybel]

It would take a little bit of the frustration out of it too ...

[Nysan]

Having trouble locating a 'beyond my skill' area. Either amateur level mines more than I remember or everything in my usual mining areas are set low by someone. I assume the problem character is inept level?

[Maybel]

Having trouble locating a 'beyond my skill' area. Either amateur level mines more than I remember or everything in my usual mining areas are set low by someone. I assume the problem character is inept level?

I am inept, so i'm guessing that is where the problem is

[Zuldere]

I been trying to make a boomerang for over two rl weeks now, is woodworking not working yet?

[Brar]

boomerang is the correct spelling I think

[Alaudrien]

maybe he was referring to a flintlock blunderbuss! <.<