Lapidary and Weaponsmithing

Beshaba · Post by **Beshaba** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 4:44 pm

Would it be possible for someone with a minimum level of competancy in both lapidary and weaponsmithing to set gems on a weapon that is crafted?

Mingus · Post by **Mingus** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:47 pm

How about after the weapon is crafted? And to prevent abuse only crafted weapons/armor can be set with stones. Making an ademdum to the lapidary trade like arrowheads and mending is to weapons, "set <stone> <weapon/armor>" and if the setting fails the armor/weapon receives damadge.

Later this could allow dwarves to put runes ont their crafts too.

Wybert · Post by **Wybert** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 11:20 pm

I really like this idea of putting gems onto weapons. Perhaps even gilded blades or precious metal hilts and pommels could be done. But I would disagree with it requiring only a minimal expertise in lapidary and weaponsmithing. The gems and settings would be subject to far more physical abuse than say a necklace. The setting of the gems would require secure settings. They would be intricate and difficult to do on a weapon so that the gems do not fall out of their settings the first time you smash that vile orc over the head with your gem studded mace. I would say it would take a master of their craft to produce gemmed weapons sturdy enough to last.

Thanks,
Wybert Wugglesnorffle.

Stayne · Post by **Stayne** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 12:56 am

I would have to agree with Wybert and even go so far as to say that Lapidary is not needed, just at least master level in Weaponsmithing.
The creation of a blade, pommel and all is part of the skill of a weaponsmith. True masters of our world did not involve others in their craft (except apprentices of course). From string and tanning animal gut to wind onto the grip, carving ivory for pommel inlays, working metal into intricate shapes, even fine fillegree styles and setting gems are all within the realm of a master sword maker.

While I can see swordsmiths interacting with a jeweler to learn more (or at least trying to as master are known not to pass on too many secrets), most swordsmiths who achieve a level that is a master rank have done enough experimentation with such things that consultation should not be needed.
That being said, I doubt a master jeweler could set jewels into a sword made at novice or apprentice level. The weapon just would not be sturdy enough to hold them. Perhaps a jeweler who purchased a masterwork sword could set jewels into it would be more feasable.

Just my thoughts
Stayne

Tierney · Post by **Tierney** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 12:53 pm

Maybe it could be made into a skill or feat that you got the ability to use one you got it trained. And not just for weapons, armor would also look neato keen all spruced up.

Drakenor · Post by **Drakenor** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 7:29 pm

I agree with stayne. Some weapons would just not be sturdy enough to hold gems. Maybe the smaller the weapon the better it need be crafted to hold gems and such? Different armour could also need better craftsman ship, maybe leather a low level, as inserting a gem in mithril would be much harder than inserting a gem in leather

Maybe mithril grandmaster, and leather apprentice or journeyman.

Inserting gems could also change the name of the armour; EG: ruby studded black leather armour

Maybe also have to have a certain number of gems so you can change the armour

Ursan · Post by **Ursan** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 11:29 pm

Always meant to post to this one, but never seemed to get round to it...

In real-life mode, I'd agree with Stayne et al about lapidary and gem-setting for weapons.

However, Forgotten Realms isnt real-life (thank heavens) so heres something I'd like to see and which perhaps takes the original suggestion a step further.

How about gem-setting being introduced, but requiring TWO PCs to complete.... one a Grand Master in the smithing of the weapon and the other a Grand master in the art of lapidary. Gems wouldnt usually be set in inferior pieces, so the combination of the two arts would ensure the worth of the end product

It would increase the opportunity for interaction, which I believe is key to the trades, and perhaps also prove more enticing to the coders as something to consider

Drakenor · Post by **Drakenor** » Mon Apr 12, 2004 3:35 am

Neat idea Ursan, but I think it would be hard to find a Grandmaster in ANY trade, let alone trying to find one for one certain train. Maybe have it where two apprentices can set gems in a inferior weapon, but the gems might fall out of place etc. The apprentices would be paying for the gems anyway

Maybe even if you know Lapidary and Weapon smithing you can set gems in the weapon, but if you are low skill level at Lapidary have the gems fall out if the weapon damages too much

Then you would have to reinsert the gems yourself, or if you bought the weapon from a PC smith in WD finding another that knows lapidary well enough to reinsert the gems in the weapon for you

Maybe even have the gems damage?

Drakenor · Post by **Drakenor** » Mon Apr 12, 2004 3:37 am

Hmmm, what about being able to quest for enchanted gems or have them enchanted, then insert them into the weapon, then the weapon could be imbued with the gems powers

. Until the gems fall out etc.

Rhelian · Post by **Rhelian** » Mon Apr 12, 2004 10:01 am

I know a lot of characters who are grandmasters at one trade or another.

The less magical items floating around the better, as far as I'm concerned, and the less powerful those that DO float around the better as well. Power items lead to power playing leads to power characters leads to degredation of mud.

Ursan · Post by **Ursan** » Mon Apr 12, 2004 11:05 pm

Now see what you did Drakenor.... you got Rhelian up on her favourite hobby horse again

But she's right, on both counts.

Grand Master trade skills do exist and that was the main thought behind the suggestion.....to make it something rare and novel.

It requires substantial effort to achieve Grand Mastery in a trade, such effort could be rewarded by these little add ons.

To take an example in the game, the makers mark for Grand Master weaponsmiths was something that was introduced last year and is now an ability for players to aspire to.

Rhelian · Post by **Rhelian** » Tue Apr 13, 2004 12:10 am

Pttth hobby DRAGON, get it right Ursan

I just don't see why every other weapon or item has to be magic uped, especially if you're talking about bringing in a new skill and RP opportunity.

You have to generally work hard to GM trades, skills, spells, weapons, what have you. When you do eventually GM something, in this case a trade, little things are a nice pat on the back for devoting your character's time and RP into one area. Being one of a few GM weaponsmiths and having the chance to work with a GM lapidarist to create something special would be something I think most people would appreciate, and the character that contracted the two to do the work would also be a part of that - having an item made which will be unique and very uncommon. It will be of suberb craftsmanship, and that in itself should be enough, before lobbing enchantments on it as well.

A beautiful weapon that is functional and also can be used in RP - "I defended the temple of <Godnamehere> against a hoarde of orcs, and in appreciation, the High Priest had this made for me. It bears the mark of not one but TWO masters, Master Weapsmithname and Master Lapname. Isn't it exquisite? Of course, it is priceless and I could not bare to part with it"

Again, these are just my personal opinions. I like the idea of special interaction between characters, but would personally hate to see magically enchanted items pop up all over the place. Good solid workmanship on a weapon is enough.

Jerigo · Post by **Jerigo** » Tue Apr 13, 2004 12:59 am

Maybe this isn't the right place to put this question, but a couple of you mentioned being able to mark things as a grandmaster. I looked but couldn't find any helpfiles on that in the game, could someone please explain it to me?

Rhelian · Post by **Rhelian** » Tue Apr 13, 2004 1:10 am

Here you go:

http://pub88.ezboard.com/fforgottenking ... ID=3.topic Old board stuff

Jerigo · Post by **Jerigo** » Tue Apr 13, 2004 2:03 am

I tried the link but it isn't working for me. Is the link wrong, or do you think it's just something with my browser?

Alaudrien · Post by **Alaudrien** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 4:37 am

I was wondering how hard it is to add in different weapon styled things into the weapon smithing trade. Like Main Gauches and Khukris? or Flamberges

Kelemvor · Post by **Kelemvor** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:40 am

The styles of weapons which can be crafted are hard-coded I believe, but I was advised that it is a straightforward process the last time I hassled Mask about the very same thing.

Given all else that is going on presently, I'd say be patient and let us get everything ship-shape and then wait the right opportunity to raise the suggestion again.

Alaudrien · Post by **Alaudrien** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 1:50 pm

Cool. I was just inquiring! ^^ I am a hard core fan of daggers and such! Thanks for the reply Kelemvor!