Coin for experience in Menzo

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Leohand
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Coin for experience in Menzo

Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:50 pm

Just wondering, since it's so hard to level up in Menzo, if a trainer can be added, so, to the newby temple, just in menzoberranzan, to by exp between level 7 and 10, for example. Like 1 platinum for a quarter level. By only opening the trainer to use after level 7, they'd still have to train, a lot, I know from experience that the creatures in the newby area don't give out much exp, even compared to other newby temples, so just getting to level seven can take an eternity. And by being in the newby temple, it can't be abused, right? It's a thought.
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Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:06 pm

Any thoughts? Anyone?
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Post by Selveem » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:16 pm

I'm sorry bud. I really can't agree with this at all. There is a lot of room for abuse that you have here. My suggestion is to try to get exp now with these new changes that've gone through.
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Post by Larethiel » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:19 pm

I agree with Selveem on that, I think it is a bit too easy to just..buy your way through the gaining of exp and levels, access to spells/skills/etc. It would open up many opportunities for abuse, but that's just my opinion.
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im Wind, der sanft über das Gräberfeld streicht.
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Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:19 pm

The problem is that for drow, all we have are the weakling kobolds that give no experience, or close two it. I USED to be able to train on goblin slaves, but now with them more powerful I can't. All that's left to my drow mage are the kobolds, and those she fought for 6 hours straight to get from level 7 to level 8, which in one fight against the strengthened goblins that was lost.
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Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:21 pm

Note, Larethiel, that I suggested that the trainer be put in the Menzberanzan newby area, meaning after level 10, you can't get back to it. And also, when you hit level 10 all your experience rolls back to zero anyway, so I don't see how it could be abused.
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Post by Larethiel » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:23 pm

I guess there would be the easy solution to....not play drow but that's not the point. If the drow had this "system" why should other start-areas not have it? And then you have things like the Express Delivery, allowing players to get coin really quick, thus buying exp really quick.
I have not played a drow and most likely will not, thus cannot speak about that ;) But if you are not pleased, making up opportunities for drow to level up without danger (though, I believe every low level character, not matter if wizard or not, is in danger leveling up) and sending them to the builders, is not a bad idea.
Weit in der Champagne im Mittsommergrün,
dort, wo zwischen Grabkreuzen Mohnblumen blühn,
da flüstern die Gräser und wiegen sich leicht
im Wind, der sanft über das Gräberfeld streicht.
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Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:29 pm

I wanted to rp the drow, and thought it would be fun, but it feels as if all these changes have been making it more difficult to do so. I mean, what works for the surface, doesn't necessarily work for the underdark. As a wizard, there are few spells you can learn unguilded, and fewer still for a wizard from Menzoberranzan. I think she knows, at most, 4 spells. And she can't join a guild until level 10, so where on the surface such a function might be abused to learn loads of spells early, the potential for abuse just isn't there in Menzoberranzan, that is why I think it would work in Menzo where it might be foolish elsewhere. Well, that's my thought.
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Post by Selveem » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:35 pm

This sounds more like a problem that should be sent over to the builders. If the newbie training area is too viscious to attempt to level in or whatever, that's something to be looked at. I think it's a bad idea to buy experience, though with Drow society... Nevermind, I just oppose it on the basis that it's too open for abuse. I could have a level 50 character I give you 10 platinum to train your weapon skills or whatever... you decide to buy a bunch of exp. Not cool.
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Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:39 pm

Just the opposite, Selveem, the creatures in the newby area are so wimpy and so low level that they don't give any experience once your beyond like level 4. The largest goblin in there I was bashing at level two. I had to move out to the mushroom grove to gain experience then, and I bashed kobolds a long time, and got to level 8, then I moved to the goblins, and I was able to bash them pretty easily. Anyway, then I was gone for a week, and when I came back, I resumed my attack on the goblins, and the very first goblin killed me. From 100 percent health to zero in under 5 seconds. If killing kobold slaves takes me 6 hours of bashing, including some time meditating, and a good deal of resting, but anyway, if it takes 6 hours to go from level 7 to level 8, that's a bit much.
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Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:44 pm

Actually, it wasn't even meditating, she doesn't have that skill yet, too low level. Figured that needed correcting. It was sitting around, waiting for her armor spell to return.
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Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:57 pm

By the way, I meant to put this under game suggestions, not general discussion, if someone would like to move it.
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Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:10 pm

These kobolds are all I have to kill that seems to gain any experience at all, though, as I said, it still takes an eternity, and below is why. They run away and flee and you chase them down, and pretty soon, you have 0 energy, and you need to rest. This is especially true for wizards.



<100%hp 100m 100%mv> n
Mushroom Grove
N-Mushroom Grove E-Mushroom Grove S-Moss Bed
Rows and rows of carefully tended mushrooms march before you.
A wide variety of types and colors are represented here, creating
a rainbow of fungi as far as the eye can see. Some are very small,
others reach for the caverntops in graceful arches. This area is
well tended by the goblin slaves, as it represents an important
food staple in the Underdark.

<100%hp 100m 98%mv> n
Mushroom Grove
E-Mushroom Grove S-Mushroom Grove
Rows and rows of carefully tended mushrooms march before you.
A wide variety of types and colors are represented here, creating
a rainbow of fungi as far as the eye can see. Some are very small,
others reach for the caverntops in graceful arches. This area is
well tended by the goblin slaves, as it represents an important
food staple in the Underdark.
Some mushrooms grow here. (perfect)

<100%hp 100m 94%mv> e
Mushroom Grove
E-Mushroom Grove S-Mushroom Grove W-Mushroom Grove
Rows and rows of carefully tended mushrooms march before you.
A wide variety of types and colors are represented here, creating
a rainbow of fungi as far as the eye can see. Some are very small,
others reach for the caverntops in graceful arches. This area is
well tended by the goblin slaves, as it represents an important
food staple in the Underdark.
A kobold slave works in the mushroom grove here.
A kobold slave works in the mushroom grove here.

<100%hp 100m 91%mv> kill ko
Your pierce nearly bisects a kobold slave's left arm.
a kobold slave is covered in cuts and bruises.

<100%hp 100m 91%mv>
Your pierce nearly bisects a kobold slave's abdomen.
a kobold slave has several traumatic wounds.

<100%hp 100m 91%mv>
A kobold slave's claws deeply punches your chest.

<97%hp 100m 91%mv>
A kobold slave's claws perforates your right leg.

<94%hp 100m 91%mv>
A kobold slave's claws deeply punches your chest.

<91%hp 100m 91%mv> c magic ko

With a sickening sound your pierce deeply perforates a kobold slave's chest.
a kobold slave has several traumatic wounds.

<91%hp 100m 91%mv>
A kobold slave's claws deeply punches your chest.

<88%hp 100m 91%mv> You begin to chant.

<88%hp 100m 91%mv>
You watch with pride as your magic missile hits a kobold slave!
a kobold slave has blood gushing from several grievous wounds.
You watch with pride as your magic missile hits a kobold slave!
a kobold slave is leaking heart-blood.
A kobold slave hops west.
A kobold slave flees head over heels!

<88%hp 91m 91%mv> c magic w ko
No such target there.

<88%hp 91m 91%mv> w
Mushroom Grove
E-Mushroom Grove S-Mushroom Grove
Rows and rows of carefully tended mushrooms march before you.
A wide variety of types and colors are represented here, creating
a rainbow of fungi as far as the eye can see. Some are very small,
others reach for the caverntops in graceful arches. This area is
well tended by the goblin slaves, as it represents an important
food staple in the Underdark.
Some mushrooms grow here. (perfect)

<88%hp 91m 88%mv> s
Mushroom Grove
N-Mushroom Grove E-Mushroom Grove S-Moss Bed
Rows and rows of carefully tended mushrooms march before you.
A wide variety of types and colors are represented here, creating
a rainbow of fungi as far as the eye can see. Some are very small,
others reach for the caverntops in graceful arches. This area is
well tended by the goblin slaves, as it represents an important
food staple in the Underdark.
(Bleeding) A kobold slave works in the mushroom grove here.

You hear the sound of footsteps from the east.
A kobold slave hops north.

<88%hp 91m 84%mv> n
kill ko
Mushroom Grove
E-Mushroom Grove S-Mushroom Grove
Rows and rows of carefully tended mushrooms march before you.
A wide variety of types and colors are represented here, creating
a rainbow of fungi as far as the eye can see. Some are very small,
others reach for the caverntops in graceful arches. This area is
well tended by the goblin slaves, as it represents an important
food staple in the Underdark.
Some mushrooms grow here. (perfect)
(Bleeding) A kobold slave works in the mushroom grove here.

<88%hp 91m 81%mv> Your pierce tears wounds into a kobold slave's left leg.
a kobold slave has suffered mortal injury.
A kobold slave hops south.
A kobold slave flees head over heels!

<88%hp 91m 81%mv> s
kill ko
Mushroom Grove
N-Mushroom Grove E-Mushroom Grove S-Moss Bed
Rows and rows of carefully tended mushrooms march before you.
A wide variety of types and colors are represented here, creating
a rainbow of fungi as far as the eye can see. Some are very small,
others reach for the caverntops in graceful arches. This area is
well tended by the goblin slaves, as it represents an important
food staple in the Underdark.
(Bleeding) A kobold slave works in the mushroom grove here.

<88%hp 91m 78%mv> With a sickening sound your pierce shreds a kobold slave's chest.
a kobold slave has suffered mortal injury.
A kobold slave hops east.
A kobold slave flees head over heels!

<88%hp 91m 78%mv> e
kill ko
Mushroom Grove
N-Mushroom Grove E-Donigarten S-Donigarten W-Mushroom Grove
Rows and rows of carefully tended mushrooms march before you.
A wide variety of types and colors are represented here, creating
a rainbow of fungi as far as the eye can see. Some are very small,
others reach for the caverntops in graceful arches. This area is
well tended by the goblin slaves, as it represents an important
food staple in the Underdark.
A kobold slave works in the mushroom grove here.
(Bleeding) A kobold slave works in the mushroom grove here.

<88%hp 91m 75%mv> A kobold slave dodges your piercing attack.

<88%hp 91m 75%mv>
a kobold slave yells 'Mgzve me de!'
A kobold slave hops west.

<88%hp 91m 75%mv>
A kobold slave dodges your piercing attack.

<88%hp 91m 75%mv>
A kobold slave's claws perforates your left arm.

<85%hp 91m 75%mv>
A kobold slave's claws penetrates your abdomen.

<82%hp 91m 75%mv> w
kill ko

A kobold slave dodges your piercing attack.

<100%hp 91m 84%mv>
You dodge a kobold slave's claws.

<100%hp 91m 84%mv>
A kobold slave's claws perforates your left leg.

<97%hp 91m 84%mv> No way! You are still fighting!

<97%hp 91m 84%mv> You do your best!

<97%hp 91m 84%mv>
A kobold slave's claws stabs your chest.

<94%hp 91m 84%mv>
A kobold slave dodges your piercing attack.

<94%hp 91m 84%mv>
A kobold slave's claws perforates your left leg.

<91%hp 91m 84%mv>
A kobold slave's claws penetrates your abdomen.

<88%hp 91m 84%mv>
A kobold slave dodges your piercing attack.

<88%hp 91m 84%mv>
You dodge a kobold slave's claws.

<88%hp 91m 84%mv>
A kobold slave dodges your piercing attack.

<88%hp 91m 84%mv>
A kobold slave's claws drills in to your left leg.

<85%hp 91m 84%mv>
You dodge a kobold slave's claws.

<85%hp 91m 84%mv>
You score a critical hit!
A kobold slave's guts spill all over the ground.
Your pierce nearly bisects a kobold slave's abdomen.
a kobold slave is bleeding freely.

<85%hp 91m 84%mv> level

A kobold slave's claws penetrates your abdomen.

<82%hp 91m 84%mv> Your journey to your next level has begun!
A kobold slave's claws perforates your right leg.

<79%hp 91m 84%mv>
You score a critical hit!
Your pierce nearly bisects a kobold slave's chest.
A kobold slave runs west.
A kobold slave flees head over heels!

<79%hp 91m 84%mv>
A kobold slave walks in from the west.

<79%hp 91m 84%mv> w
Mushroom Grove
N-Mushroom Grove E-Mushroom Grove S-Moss Bed
Rows and rows of carefully tended mushrooms march before you.
A wide variety of types and colors are represented here, creating
a rainbow of fungi as far as the eye can see. Some are very small,
others reach for the caverntops in graceful arches. This area is
well tended by the goblin slaves, as it represents an important
food staple in the Underdark.
Windows 95: n.
32 bit extensions and a graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit operating system originally coded for a 4 bit microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that can't stand 1 bit of competition.
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Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:54 pm

Still no one is posting, so quoting Columbo: 'One more thing'

while there's all this talk about making foes more difficult, noone is mentioning altering experience gained. These kobolds are much more powerful as well, and so far I've seen no gain. If they are more powerful, but not more beneficial, then I am faced with much more then the six hours it took to hit level 8 the first time, before the goblin killed me.
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Post by Kelemvor » Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:08 pm

Possibly, curbing the number of your own posts might encourage others to post.

If you wish to add more, edit the original post or combine the additions into a single extra post.

Similarly, don't post lengthy logs straight into the message. It's usually easier to read and understand a point in a log if you quote it, which shrinks the text and colorises it.

Finally, with so much else going on in the game at the moment it is not realistic to expect instant responses to posts made that day.

*Kelemvor who just waded through 40+ posts and 10 PMs*
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Post by Leohand » Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:48 pm

I guess that did sound kinda impatient of me, huh? It's just that about two weeks ago someone mentioned a change you were planning to implement, I forget what it was, but I had to point out that it would hurt underdark role-play possibilities, a lot. I guess I was hoping that I'd gotten through to the right people, so they could consider the consequences to the underdark rp before making this sort of change, but I guess at that I failed... (sigh)

It's my experience, that punishments made to 'everyone' hyrt the underdark races a whole lot more. There are not a variety of places for low level people to train, there's one, and now this change has complicated that spot even more, and there's nothing for a drow to do until they hit level 10.

I apologize for my string of posts, it's just, as I said, this change affects me a lot, and it's just the sort of thing I was trying to warn people about weeks ago. It's a bit irksome.



edit - Dalvyn never replied to my PM, guess he probably gets lots, but I do seem to be gaining exp faster, so I guess the exp awarded has been increased. It's still slow, but it actually seems to be gaining faster, so I guess that answers my question to him, the considerable greater risk is rewarded, so I guess that ends the subject. Anyway, one can hardly blame me for being irked, I did get killed by a goblin in five seconds that a week ago I could slaughter easily, and I lost a level, that was extremely tedious and hard to earn in the first place, and then I found out that my only option to train on was much stronger, and no one could say if the exp reward was increased, and until I few moments ago I hadn't seen a change. I mean, it changed a half hour ago too, or thereabouts, but that could be explained as just being lose to the change still, but a change again, so soon, seems to be better then before. Anyway, that's what it looks like to me. I guess I may be mistaken, but it doesn't seem to take as long.



Edit2 - Talk about making me feel pretty dumb, lol, once I stopped complaining and started training the difference became quite obvious. There's way more risk, yes, but the difference in exp gains is considerable. Oh, and the thing that was suggested before that I had to chastise about was the removal of the auto-heal feature. I told them that such a change with unfairly affect drow, who don't get many rp opportunities, and can't always have a priestess or priest behind them. This system, as it is, will function better then the old one, hehe. (pulls stick out of behind) Sorry.
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32 bit extensions and a graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit operating system originally coded for a 4 bit microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that can't stand 1 bit of competition.
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Post by Lathander » Fri Nov 30, 2007 2:21 am

There is always the option of you building an area to add down there. :twisted:
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Post by Leohand » Fri Nov 30, 2007 2:36 am

Before I got going on this whole line of talk, I asked if experience gains were edited too, and that got ignored, which caused me to start this thread, lol. If someone had just told me yes, I would have been alright, hehe. But making a bunch of monsters more difficulty without increasing the exp gain would have been bad, since we were talking about the only low-level training area drow have. The experience there was already too hard to come by, you know? But with the change to their difficulty, the experience awarded has finally been increased to reasonable level.
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Post by Jharthyne » Fri Nov 30, 2007 5:41 am

I guess that is why you need kismet to be a drow. The average newbie is not going to have the experience playing in this MUD to know the challenges involved in developing a drow character.

Levelling up characters, esp new ones, is always a pain. At least on the surface, level is not as important, since the focus is more on rp and there are lots of people to rp with on the surface. In the Underdark, I think the player base is smaller and with less rp, you get to spend time on levelling, and anything that affects combat will have a greater overall gameplay effect.

That said, as Lathander mentioned, more areas can always be created to cater for low-level Underdark characters for them to train in.

Having a trainer that converts cash to xp brings abt issues of abuse that may be too big to handle and implement properly. It may just be a better option to take the time to slowly train up the character. Time spent developing a character actually helps to bond the character to the player, and gives you time to develop a character history as well.
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