Possible Plots to be seen?

[Pascus]

Hello Everyone,

I was actually sitting here and thinking what could be done about the situation, where there is all these good people and nothing happening outsided of the coded events to heat up the world around us? So I would like to ask other players what sort of plots that we as players could insight that you would help incite players to react outside of their every day routine, after all we all love a good story right? So if you'd like hit up some ideas that might spark a thought in another player to bring something to the world.

[Sairaven]

I can say that there are plotlines to be had, if you know where to look / are observant enough. I'm personally involved in about 4 with Quey, and Sairaven has one or two (but they're somewhat on hold given that he's trying to better his personal life).

One of the things that I like are political / social plotlines. Courtly relations and intrigue and all that. But many of those type of plots mean you can't have OOC information floating around willy-nilly (and I'm just as guilty as anyone at that). But I've been working on political intrigue plots for a long time, in other games both in table-top, LARP, and Muds, so I can say I enjoy those kinds.

[Oghma]

I personally try to avoid setting up any plots ooc and prefer to format my actions icly. OOC has too much of a scripted feel to me, while ic actions either reflect the situation as it occurs or the mood of the player and ic rp of the character. Though I welcome quest ideas for the game that involve a group effort to complete. For example there are several group driven quests in game that have certain standards and plots around them that need to be planned for icly by characters to harness unique talents.

[Raona]

I'd like to echo what Sairaven said - there are plots aplenty in the game, though the active Imm-driven ones seem dormant at the moment, I think because the Imms are working hard on implementing resistances into the game. You can get a sense of these (past and present) by reading the Kingdom's Journal forum.

An ongoing challenge has been involving more players in these large-scale RPs. In the past, some PCs tried to "force" themselves into them, even where they ICly it made no sense for them to know of the events, or work with those already involved. I think this was in some cases driven by frustration at having applications (or just un-applied IC efforts) to add a counter-plot ignored, or not sufficiently supported. (For example, [this is fictional!] a group of gnomes is visited by the ghost of a gnomish wizard, who tells them of his forgotten home. They go there, only find a drow and a dwarf are already there, poking around. A group of rogues submits an application to steal any and all magic the poor gnomes might find, with no explanation of how they even know there's magic to steal. Another group, of human wizards, submits an application to send an exploration party to the place, explaining that they learned of it while watching the gnomes with a magic eye; a good application, but the Imm behind the ghost doesn't have time, and ends up never replying to the application. Wizards are [understandably] frustrated. An elven wizard approaches the gnomes ICly and asks them to share the magic they find, or to join the gnomes in the exploration, but one of the gnomes has had a bad history with this elf and says no way. The elf is mad, feels left out.) But in other cases, those who know of a large-scale RP don't share what they know with others, often to the great frustration of whoever's behind the RP. Also, some player's RP styles just don't mesh, and even if they are both great players, it doesn't work to have both of them involved in key aspects of the same RP; they just derail it. One might be a thinker, who moves slowly and deliberately, the other, a melee-lover who moves quickly and decisively.

I guess what I am trying to say is that Pascus raises a difficult issue, and we as players can do four things to help matters, as I see it:
1) Do our best to advance large-scale plots and RPs driven by the Imms - tell ICly-appropriate others of them, develop our own sub-plot and carry it along (realizing that it likely won't get Imm support, but applying for such if we'd really like it, ready to get a no answer), remember the IC past and talk about it. [Examples of the last: How much chatter is there about Bane now? Have any new players asked about what happened in Markana's village?]
2) As players, drive our own RPs and plots in such a way as to involve others, where ICly reasonable and OOCly workable. Take the case of Jakoora - that, I think, is all player-initiated RP. It need not be conflict-driven! If an area has you stopped cold, and you are waiting until you are higher level, get together others to help you with it, instead. Be interested in what's going on in the IC world - others with children on the way, broken hearts, new scars, stuff like that. Share stories, tales of discovery, new things you have found and so on. You don't have to be an Imm to start and advance your own story line or plot twist, though you may have to be very patient. [Raona's been trying to defuse the bandit problem for a long time - to no avail so far, but it's driven a lot of RP involving plenty of folks!]
3) If you have what you think would be a really great plot idea , send it in to applications. I think the Imms are short of time, not ideas, but there's even a mechanism whereby you might be given what you need to advance your plot idea yourself. Keep in mind that if the moral of the plot suggestion is that you get super-powerful...uh...don't count on it being seen as really great by many people outside the circle of you, yourself, and ye.
4) If you are one of those who was lucky enough to be involved in a large-scale RP: If you thought it was awesome, thank the Imm that put all the work and sleepless hours into planning, setting up, and running it. If you didn't like it, don't pretend you did when talking about it with other players. These RPs are often more fun in principle than in practice, but the common impression out there is that they are the best thing ever - the expectations are often unrealistically high. They require patience on the part of the involved players and don't always come with the rewards they might most be hoping for, be it priceless RP or unique treasures.

That's my 22 cents...thanks for reading.

[Lathander]

I'll be honest with you, my plots (3 I think?) are all in stasis because of exhaustive real-world responsibilities. When I do have time to log in I do so in one of two ways: 1.) As one of my morts that does some less than stellar rp because I am mostly in another window doing "real" work. 2.) As Lathander to monitor the game, help people who need imm assistance to solve an issue or deal with complaints/application issues.

Here is something though that is a both a pet peeve of mind and an opportunity for players to spice up existing plot lines. Often when an imm starts an rp that takes several sessions or is open-ended, there is an expectation that the plot will have a life of its own beyond what the imm controls. In several, commendable cases PCs take an imm-instigated plot and run with it. They talk about it when the imm isn't around. They involve other players. They keep the plot alive. In too many other instances, the plot dies once the imm puts the dice in the bag and goes home for the day (or week, or month!). Players log alts and only bring on the involved PC when they learn that the imm is ready to be the impetus behind the rp once more. I think that the developing "character" of every PC can deepen by rping without the imm.

[Glim]

Erm, I could be completely wrong but I don't think this post is in reference to major plots or even imm plots. What I got from Pascus's post is for people to post ideas on player-driven events/rps/etc. Sort of a brainstorm sort of thing. Doesn't seem to make sense to tell the player, well they are all over, just look, when he is trying to fuel ideas for players to start their own and to help them get out of Waterdeep and start something.

[Pascus]

Exactly I was speaking about player driven plots that we could piece together, I think the imms do what they can when they can. I just feel that a lot of people need to get out and put that RP talent and storytelling to action! We all play the mud because of its many possible actions it can take....We all have the ability to cause plots, and if a Imm wants to join in then Im sure players wont care at all. I personally love Politics and such, but there are many more possibilities.

[Raona]

Erm, I could be completely wrong but I don't think this post is in reference to major plots or even imm plots. What I got from Pascus's post is for people to post ideas on player-driven events/rps/etc. Sort of a brainstorm sort of thing. Doesn't seem to make sense to tell the player, well they are all over, just look, when he is trying to fuel ideas for players to start their own and to help them get out of Waterdeep and start something.

Exactly I was speaking about player driven plots that we could piece together, I think the imms do what they can when they can. I just feel that a lot of people need to get out and put that RP talent and storytelling to action! We all play the mud because of its many possible actions it can take....We all have the ability to cause plots, and if a Imm wants to join in then Im sure players wont care at all. I personally love Politics and such, but there are many more possibilities.

Ah, my apologies! I see this happening too - the elves, in particular, have been getting their elven mojo/attitude going on of late - but there's always new ideas to be had. My apologies for the derailment - please, let's brainstorm away!

I've been trying to organize investigations of the bandit lairs and dark Ardeep, and investigating a theft problem in the Deep, but I'm not sure if that's the sort of thing you have in mind, Pascus? I'd echo Gwain's concern, above, that OOC planning of how a roleplay should play out is probably not a great idea - things should unfold organically, in real time, ICly. That said, though, the seeds (starting points) of player-driven RP ideas would be a great topic for discussion.

[Travis]

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[Lathander]

My apologies. I misinterpreted the initial subject.

[Pascus]

See that is what Im talking about Travis, although you could have asked if any players of thieves wanted to get involved in a RP to prvt you that way you could send the IMMs a list of all the players that wanted to help in the theft. But awsome way to think of ways to make the game intresting without the Imms having to do anything really.

[Travis]

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[Meekir]

One thing I would suggest is promoting background ties. I feel strongly that it's OK to start things OOC (because relying only on chance encounters IC, in such a large world with such varying times we play, does not promote roleplay the way some OOC planning might). This would be one source of player plots that requires a little planning with a lot of pay-off.

What I mean is, amicably suggest to people (preferably those you don't usually play with!) your willingness to develop a background as rivals, allies, siblings, mentor/apprentice, wily criminal/vigilante wanting to put them away, anything. Agree on a few initial points of "what has already happened", and you hit the ground running with a player plot. This can be very simple ("we don't like each other" ... childhood rivals, the warrior always bullied the apprentice wizard around... she tried to steal from me once, and I still don;t believe that story of her eight kids and blind grandma...) to as complex as you want to get. Of course, the best ties are those that allow you to talk and roleplay rather than instantly coming to blows whenever you see each other.

I'd personally enjoy hooking up with a player of opposing alignments to create some "arch enemy" kind of relationship, and I think more of that would be fun. It could be done between groups of rival faiths, competing groups of adventurers, cities, etc. Purosefully and mutually scripting something that has "already happened" lets you be instantly involved in more plot to come. It's the set-up for more improvised scenes.

Yep. Background ties can be very good for player-based plots.

[Pascus]

A question to put out there, so perhaps other players could see this. There is a whole world out there to be had, Would the imms be opposed to a player sending in some sort of proposal for their character to do something well within their means as a character to start roleplay and events within the mud? I mean if players are able to do this, and influence villages to turn certain ways and all that then we could have a arena of roleplaying. It seems to me that most players feel they do the quests, and just play as a character but they can't influence the world with their character only other players...what are the admins and other players thoughts on this?

[Kirkus]

Well I think I understand what you are trying to get at, and here is my take on the subject. It would be nice, but it might be a lot of code work.

Back when the Talos faithful were active we would, every once in a while, go to a village and rp with the mobs, as in force them to offer their pleas for mercy and their monetary donations. This was about all we could do, every so often we would get some imm assistance in the form of getting the mobs to act along, it was nice. But in the end it always seemed to come down to 'torching the village'.

Now my point is this, even if we took a torch and put it on the ground in every room, which would actually look pretty cool, twenty minutes or so later, after we were long gone, there is going to be no way to tell that we were there. The rooms will look the same the mobs will look and act the same.

You would have to go in and recode the area to be different. Different mobs or different rooms. But that sounds like it could be a viable option. Write up a village. Plan out some group rp that can shift the influence of the area back and fourth. I think that could be pretty nifty. Like a group of goodies goes in and does one rp and when they leave the town is mildly good. Then a group of evils goes in and does a rp of some sort and when they leave the town is acting mildly bad. If it would work....

[Pascus]

But see, that is the sort of things that get games involved. People know events happen, and try to stop them. Nobody will want to come fight a band of Talosians if they know "Oh there will be a repop in five minutes." I think if we as players add a aspect to the game that makes it more interactive and more roleplaying then we can get more people to do the same hence making the world a "real world" not just a place for mobs to run around and we are stuck in only going to rp with other people because there is no rp anywhere else. Which is why I believe a lot of people stay within Waterdeep and the other villages are left abandoned because nobody would go there unless they feel like sitting alone. Also we should realize that the great thing about playing a mud, is that anything can happen that we want to happen within our imagination. That is not something you can get on a graphics game that has a set plot or is limited to only how the programmers put it. We can create new cities, we can gain relics from making a dig site of a area once held by a great civilization, or even bargin with a lich for powerful items or something else! Its all what we make of it.

[Sairaven]

Which is why I believe a lot of people stay within Waterdeep and the other villages are left abandoned because nobody would go there unless they feel like sitting alone.

I spent nearly two months sitting in Berdusk, and saw about two people. Neither of which returned an emoted greeting.

Yeah... Cities sit empty because everyone knows Waterdeep is where you go for RP. Even the Band of Burning Blades taking their RP to Daggerford didn't really make much of a change.

[Dovan]

Just to play along further with your idea and expand on it. I use to play an online game (name withheld) that had an area that 3 certain factions fought for. Each faction had their own "camp" and they could in turn try and take over opposing faction camps. Players in turn could help influence the take over of camps by physically removing leaders of certain camps. Once the invasion force from one camp took over another, the whole area would repopulate with the winning forces mobs.

Perhaps in this setting... use just a 2 force opposition. Say enter Camp A and talk with their "leader" and agree to assist them. This would initate their "raid" upon Camp B. Players could in sneak into Camp B and remove the opposition in turn to help the take over.

Just helpin roll the thought around.

[Sairaven]

Years ago, I played in another Forgotten Realms MUD that is no longer around. At the pinnacle of its popularity, however, each city had its own lord, own militia, own population of PCs. Having the PC lord(s) and militia often led to political domain conflicts. If, for instance, the lord of Suzail wanted to expand into Cormyr, the lord of Cormyr could raise his army to stop them.

I don't know if we have the player base for it, but with a few modifications (like adding an NPC army under PC commanders, for instance), I think it might be possible.

[Pascus]

Well we have the Zhentarim and the Harpers already that Im sure rp will start soon about them waring over the realms, But there are certain things that can happen, say you apply to become a certain towns leaders advisor or something. Play off politics put characters in roles that matter. Right now, I feel we are running around like chickens with our heads cut off doing quests that we act like dont even affect the game. (A roleplay I tried to get started which some players were apart of that dealt with Zhentarim and Malarites.) There are wars all the time in the Realms we are acting like all is fine and dandy because we don't hear anything happening, and we don't hear it happening because we as players I feel aren't taking the steps to start things. Such as a character starting a school, which could also be used to stimulate roleplay on so many levels. Don't use this but perhaps if you kidnapped the school founder and randsomed him for a artifact or something from the school perhaps to force a certain character into the school that would otherwise get rejected. Granted this would take a NE or CN alignment but its all about what we want to do.