Who List

[Bellayana]

Would it be possible for the who list to have the Account Names shown instead of character names, I feel like the who list is often used to narrow down IC information that should not be accessible to begin with. The who list can be used then to determine if other people are about and able to play, and if a player wants their name to be associated then they can put it in the Title next to their account name. This would cut down on a lot of OOC knowledge being used ICly.

[Selveem]

That's a bit useless for many people.

Think in terms of FMs and staff members. Most players on FK have more than a single character. If one of yours needs to get in contact with a specific member, you won't know when said PC is online. I feel that would only increase the amount of OOC knowledge needed (and used).

Additionally, your account name could then be cross-referenced to all your characters, making it easier for players to (even unintentionally) figure out who all your alts are.

[Brar]

I would rather see about nondetection or mind shielding, or detune remove you from the who list for non imms.

Perhaps also disguise could remove you from the list too.

Just ideas.

[Selveem]

Why not just do away with the who list altogether, then?

The way I see it, the less people showing up on the who list, the less people are motivated to log in/stay logged in.

I think it'd be better we not have the option than to see a small percentage representation of how many are online.

[Bellayana]

We do have IC ways to contact people when they are offline- these have been placed into the game for a reason. If you really need to contact someone IC and they are not online you can do it.

[Briek]

The who list is a valuble tool for grouping, finding other players for faith roleplays and all sorts not to mention the IMMs using it.

I think the pros outweigh the cons in this case

[Theodic]

Hello All,

Good ieas so far. I am wondering if it is possible for the who list to show the characters short description if you have yet to meet them instead of their name and title. That way it will be ambiguous to those who have not met IC. For those who have met, the Character name and title could be shown as is already.

[Brodnur]

Hello All,

Good ieas so far. I am wondering if it is possible for the who list to show the characters short description if you have yet to meet them instead of their name and title. That way it will be ambiguous to those who have not met IC. For those who have met, the Character name and title could be shown as is already.

Just my two coppers, but in a case such as this, I know I have a couple chars that don't greet just anyone they meet, and having the wrong PC's know their actual desc, or even just the adjective that goes with said character, it'd be giving too much away, I'm thinking. Just one bloke's opinion

[Adabelle]

The who list is a necessary part of a game. It is an important tool for people getting together. There are very few times when I get together and go adventuring with people because our paths happened to cross. Usually I seek people out using the who list and tells. Without those two tools I think the MUD would become a very lonely place.

[Bellayana]

I agree it helps a lot, but maybe the greet system could be utilized like what was suggested. Instead of seeing someone's name you see their adjective and if they greeted you then you see the name. I mean even if they are polymorphed or disguised their original adjective would still be on the who list. I like the ability to know who is on, but I just wanted to throw this up to discuss.

[Rhangalas]

Yep. I've suggested it before with one of my other characters, but instead of creating a hassle with short description or account names, I thought the most simple way to go about it was to keep the command, but only have it return something like:

You sense that there are <#> adventurers roaming the Realms.

The 'who' command would be tied in with amulets, just to give it some semblance of uh, realism... and those without amulets (excluding dead people) would not be able to use it.

You would still be able to use the 'who' command to see how many players are on, but without a list of names. To replace that sometimes much needed list, you would have a notify command instead. The command would be solely OOC and only as a tool to facilitate RP, much like the who list, minus the omniscience. You could tie this into the amulets as well, but it's OOC, so it really doesn't matter.

-Syntax-
Notify: A command that globally alerts all those online that you are online.
Notify <guild/clan/faith>: A command that alerts the target group that you are online.
Notify <player>: A command that alerts only the target player that you are online.

e.g. <Player> (group association is appended here if applicable) has notified you that they are online. Type notify to respond.

Of course, short descriptions would take the place of names if you should happen to receive notification from an unknown character. Once a player has notified, the person(s) receiving it would have a choice whether or not to OOCly make their presence known.

To alleviate some of the hassle this would cause with the dead seeking resurrection, 'faithed' clerics could be granted a toggle command/ability that allows them to be visible to the dead via the 'who' command if they want to be.

[Selveem]

I like to see a lot of changes; especially things that move towards 3.5, but this is one I really just feel it's best to leave alone. Making something this simple so complicated, I believe, would just be more a hassle to those attempting to use it.

Instead, what will occur, is that people will just tell other people when they're online via IMs and if they can't get on IMs they'll probably just make an alias that spams notifications out to everyone they can think of that might be interested in knowing when they come online.

Honestly, if I'm trying to pay attention to an RP or if I'm with a decently sized group in the Undermountain, I don't want any of you spamming me with notifications.

[Raona]

I see the logic here - perhaps PCs could toggle their presence on WHO, and it would just say "There are also X PCs online but hidden from the WHO list at present."

If you kept this on all the time...you would be a pretty lonely person. There are times you long for that (don't I know it!), and times when it helps ensure only IC information is used, so it might be worthwhile.

[Keller]

If this is changed so that players can hide themselves on the who list, I would suggest not removing their 'slot' from the who list.
Have them listed as (unknown) An indiscernible presence
Or something to that effect instead.

Why? Because as some have stated, an empty who list is one of the most unpleasant things for a newbie to see, and is often one of the primary reasons a potential new player will quit playing rather than stick around. Few players pay attention to the numbers displayed on a who list, either they're too new to even understand them or too jaded to care.

Anyway, tldr: I think everyone online should be listed on the who list, whether or not you can tell who they are. I'm fine with the current who list as well.

[Ramirus]

I think changing this might make sense at some point if we had tons of players on regularly, so people would not have to pay attention to who was online or who wasn't, but as the current situation stands, to me it does not seem like this would help more than it takes away. The toggle Raona suggested is a viable middle ground between changing it as proposed and keeping it the same, however.

[Athon]

I really don't want to see the who list changed. I don't see a need for the change and it's nice to see who is available to RP with.

Consider, one of the cooler things is typing "who" and seeing a list of 20-30 different people on all at once. The who list is massive. Hiding from the who list and just saying "There are x people online" REALLY loses the effect of the who list, especially when we're trying to recruit and retain players.

Issues that the OP is referring to should be handled as a case-by-case basis by admins if possible. There are many of us that will RP properly and accordingly to the situation. If something is done out of line (using the who list as OOC info to turn the tide on a possible RP), log it and report it. To me, that's the better way of resolving this situation than changing the who list.

[Gwain]

There is a general belief among some that the who list can be used to oocly find them in response to their actions ic. I'd like to believe that it is not through ooc means that we find people, but through the ic actions they commit, that though they consider their actions icly to be foolproof or even bulletproof, if they are commited with an air of ooc, then they deserve to be caught. The who list, is the who list. It tells us who is on. If you don't want your adjective exposed through it, you can turn on privacy. You should show up online because you are online. If you feel you are being unfairly targeted through it or bullied, then I would suggest using the complaints forum.

I'm in favour of keeping the who list as is, the only thing I'd welcome is some colour coding or titles for in front of names.

[Keltorn]

I feel like this could very easily be a function of the Privacy option, and it's one I would be in favor of. The Who list should still display the total number of players online, including the hidden ones, to keep extroverts from bursting into tears when they see low numbers. It wouldn't be any different from this forum's little "Who list" on the front page (which, as of right now, has only guests and hidden users yet still lists how many of each are online). If players are permitted a Privacy function in regards to the Finger command, I can't comprehend why it would be any different with the Who list. Privacy, when desired, is a good thing.

As for people trying to hide OOCly from IC consequences, I can see where Gwain's coming from, but I don't think it quite applies here. The Who list might let people know when a fugitive is online, but it also lets the runaway know when his pursuers are on. If someone wants to hide OOCly from someone else, I'm pretty sure the Quit command is the most important tool available. I can't count the number of times someone escaped the consequences of their actions by simply quitting (Hit-and-Run Tellers, I'm looking at you). Plus, the people you really need to hide from aren't going to let privacy work on them. They are always watching.

[Gwain]

Did not consider the otherside of this. I agree it would be fun for them to not know who is after them

[Keltorn]

Did not consider the otherside of this. I agree it would be fun for them to not know who is after them

With the longer lasting components, you can afford to occasionally cast Magic Mirror or the like. When you get a hit, you go after him, and he'll never see you coming.