Language spell for Paladins?

[Raona]

Would it make sense to give paladins access to one of the translation spells? They often find themselves in the role of diplomat or negotiator, and even if they spend a lot on INT and language study, they can never learn all the languages they might need. (Raona knows 9, but still frequently finds herself in situations where she can't communicate.)

A paladin language spell wouldn't be canon, but might be a fair substitute for "Discern Lies": we have to figure out a lie on our own, but that's very hard to do through a translator.

Opinions sought, from paladins and non-paladins alike.

[Nysan]

Buy tongues/comprehend languages potions?

On a serious note, I don't see an issue with paladins gaining communication spells. As you said, it replaces the discern lies ability, so it is a 'fill in a hole' move basically. And, to be perfectly honest, it's paladins. Not like this will impact a huge number of characters anyways.

[Selveem]

I feel as though it blurs the line into traditional caster territory. In the old days, people would say 'If you don't have the spell, get a Priest or Wizard' with claims that it encourages RP.

I don't agree with the discern lies reasoning as discern lies requires surpassing creatures' will save, is not mobile, and requires a concentration check every single six seconds; comprehend languages is just a straight 10 mins/caster level, targets the caster so there's no save, and is mobile (since it targets the caster).

But, to be fair, I don't feel strongly about it. I don't own a Paladin. Maybe Paladins do need a little more utility? Unfortunately, I wouldn't know.

[Keltorn]

I'm kind of agreeing with Selveem. If you find yourself in a situation where you need something you can't provide for yourself, then it's a good situation to call in some help and enjoy the roleplay that comes with it. I also agree that the language spells and Discern Lies aren't really that similar, so adding a language spell for paladins would really be adding something new as opposed to replacing a missing spell.

While I'm inclined to say "Tough, deal with it" to Raona's plight, I don't feel particularly opposed to the idea, either. I'm feeling kind of ambivalent.

I do wonder which spell you have in mind, Raona? Comprehend Languages would let a paladin understand the exact choice of words being used (and perhaps judge their veracity), but you'd still need a translator to express your side of the conversation. Tongues, on the other hand, I expect would be used mostly for getting access to trainers that a paladin does not have a common language with.

Like I said, I don't really feel strongly for or against this idea, but I do think Comprehend Languages may be the better spell candidate. It helps with the roleplay situations that Raona has described without making paladins that much stronger.

Also, as someone that's been on the other side of Raona's attempted conversations in unfamiliar languages, I will say that I very much enjoyed the roleplaying that came with her polyglotism. I think she does great without any language magic.

[Briek]

but might be a fair substitute for "Discern Lies"

I think a class bonus to sense motive would cover this?

They often find themselves in the role of diplomat or negotiator

fair point though, though I'd agree if we were to give them any language spells at all it should be Comprehend Languages

[Zorinar]

I think it would be over extending paladin's abilities.
D&D does not give paladins such spells.

I would be more in favor of giving abilities and spells that should be given to classes but are not in game, as opposed to giving spells to classes that should not have them just to make their lives easier.

[Harroghty]

Hm. I disagree with giving paladins this ability because I really do not see the need; it is a slippery slope when we begin adding things to classes that could be convenient. They could just as soon bring another PC with them in order to have that ability or use a potion.

[Jharthyne]

I have to say that I think this is not a good idea. We went along making the classes more in line with the 3ed rules, it doesn't make sense to give them abilities just to make them more able to fulfill their perceived roles. Rangers in the past were a lot more capable because they had skills that really allowed them to survive on their own, but the change in rules meant that some of those skills are no longer available or as useful. If another class has to play by the (3ed-like) rules, I don't see why paladins should be given special treatment.

However, if the ruling is to make the game a better experience for everyone by making each class more useful, the review should be across the board and not just paladins.