Raising the Dead: Roleplay and etiquette versus Favor

[Timaeus]

I am wondering about the etiquette and behavior associated with bringing a dead character back to life. When my priest raises a person I use smotes and roleplay the 'event'. Often times if there is another priest present, the moment the person is raised they immediately begin to spam out cure light spells in a pitiful mad dash for favor and interrupt the roleplay of bringing the person back to life and the asking of a task to perform in the name of my deity. Is it too much to ask that when you are a priest at a raising being performed by another priest that you wait until the roleplay is resolved before you spam everyone with cure light spell echos? Perhaps even wait for the raising priest to give a go ahead or wait for them to start casting spells?

Timaeus Valierius,
Warrior of Kelemvor.

[Glim]

I know the way your thinking Timaeus, but also remember that the raised char in question is probably in an excruciating amount of pain and the priests/priestesses present wish to relieve them of this pain as soon as possible. Its not all always about favor, and your right, but perhaps sometimes you should wait until they are fully recovered and can comprehend what your saying, being raised from the dead takes alot out of you and I know that its hard to think or even comprehend what anyone is saying when pain is wracking through every bone in your body.

[Paxos]

I agree with Glim, and if you glance at someone you'll notice that they have all of the wounds, etc, extremely hurt at raising... I don't think you want to request someone to do something for their God while they're on the brink of death, still, regardless of the fact that they're going to survive codewise.

Paxos

[Andreas]

I agree with Timeaus - DON'T SPAM CURE SPELLS!!

The PC is back to life and they will regain hp etc. without the need for cure spells. The spam is EXTREMELY disruptive to roleplay. Remember, this is a ROLEPLAY game. The numbers (hp's, favour etc.) are secondary. One priest spamming cure spells is bad enough, two or three is just a mess.

Personally, I find it rude and inconsiderate when I've gone to the trouble of raising a PC (not directly, but I help out enough) and going through all the roleplay leading up to the HUGE blessing of life... only to have it all ruined by some spammy priest popping off spells left and right.

I think everyone just needs to have a little more patience and spend a bit more time ROLEPLAYING and not worry so much about the numbers when it comes to raising the dead.

[Rhelian]

Not having died I'm not too sure but don't you get raised with a BLEEDING tag? That's my understanding, and it's probably poor RP to raise someone and let them bleed to death five minutes later

[Belose]

Actually, I can see both sides of this issue. But I almost always ask an injured person if they'd like to be healed, and if they say yes, then I do. And I haven't had too many other priests around when I've done a raising, so I usually am the one to do the healing, too. Personally, I think I'd want to be healed as soon as possible. I also don't think it's a hamper to Roleplay.. I think you can roleplay during it or even around it. Course, I don't use a lot of cure light wounds, which really CAN be spammy. You'd think they'd pant a little after praying for so many light cures...

[Timaeus]

None of the characters I have raised have had a bleeding flag upon being raised. Its not about a need to see a person healed to relieve suffering as quickly as possible, the priests who have interrupted the roleplay of my priest raising someone have better cure spells than cure light they know it and so do I. Its about favor and nothing so noble as easing suffering. My priest does see to it that the person is at a reasonable health level before asking the raised player about the task they need to do. There is roleplay during the whole process of raising. And curing spells are a range of touch, the intruding priests are what basically shoving the raising priest aside?

An example of an uninterrupted raising:
Kladian kneels next to the body placing his hand on the leg. 'Lord of Knowledge I beg of your kindness and favor to allow me the prayer to bring this Lady to life. To learn from her experience and be given another chance.'.
You begin to pray.
An tiny scroll glows briefly.
Some obsidian glows brightly, then disappears in a puff of smoke!
A muscular, hazel eyed female human has been raised from the dead.
Kladian places his hand on A muscular, hazel eyed female human's shoulder. 'Rest easy Lady, you are safe, safe in the Font of Knowledge in Waterdeep.'.
A muscular, hazel eyed female human lets out a groan, but stays still with closed eyes.
Kladian smiles and holds her steady with his hand as he utters prayers to Oghma.
You begin to pray.
You cure A muscular, hazel eyed female human's critical wounds.
A blue glow emanates from An tiny scroll.
You begin to pray.
You cure A muscular, hazel eyed female human's critical wounds.
A blue glow emanates from An tiny scroll.
You cure A muscular, hazel eyed female human's light wounds.
A blue glow emanates from An tiny scroll.
Kladian lifts his hand and speaks quiely and comfortingly. 'I am Loremaster Kladian Sandail, if you rest I shall tend your wounds before we speak.'
A muscular, hazel eyed female human keeps her eyes closed while saying back to you 'My name is Sarah.. Thank you'.
Sarah fits a midnight blue gown with silver trim on her body.
Sarah quickly slips the gown over herself.
Kladian turns back to Sarah 'I need ask a task for my Lords prayers in bringing you to life.'.

SAME raising with the favor hound priests present:
Kladian kneels next to the body placing his hand on the leg. 'Lord of Knowledge I beg of your kindness and favor to allow me the prayer to bring this Lady to life. To learn from her experience and be given another chance.'.
You begin to pray.
An tiny scroll glows briefly.
Some obsidian glows brightly, then disappears in a puff of smoke!
A muscular, hazel eyed female human has been raised from the dead.
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
Kladian places his hand on A muscular, hazel eyed female human's shoulder. 'Rest easy Lady, you are safe, safe in the Font of Knowledge in Waterdeep.'.
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
A muscular, hazel eyed female human lets out a groan, but stays still with closed eyes.
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
Kladian smiles and holds her steady with his hand as he utters prayers to Oghma.
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
You begin to pray.
You cure A muscular, hazel eyed female human's critical wounds.
A blue glow emanates from An tiny scroll.
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
You begin to pray.
You cure A muscular, hazel eyed female human's critical wounds.
A blue glow emanates from An tiny scroll.
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
You cure A muscular, hazel eyed female human's light wounds.
A blue glow emanates from An tiny scroll.
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
Kladian lifts his hand and speaks quiely and comfortingly. 'I am Loremaster Kladian Sandail, if you rest I shall tend your wounds before we speak.'
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST DROPS TO MEDITATE
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
A muscular, hazel eyed female human keeps her eyes closed while saying back to you 'My name is Sarah.. Thank you'.
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
Sarah fits a midnight blue gown with silver trim on her body.
Sarah quickly slips the gown over herself.
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
Kladian turns back to Sarah 'I need ask a task for my Lords prayers in bringing you to life.'.
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST BEGINS TO PRAY
FAVOR HOUND PRIEST CASTS CURE LIGHT

You get the idea.
By all means spam out cure light after the roleplay of being raised has been resolved I don't care. But don't be so rude to the other players in your mad dash for favor while the raising roleplay is being conducted. For those who can't scroll back on their MU* clients they could very well miss something said or an action of the roleplay while your spamming your way to Favour: loved.

Timaeus Valierius,
Warrior of Kelemvor.

[Andreas]

Spam
====
No, we are not talking about a luncheon meat here. Spam is the repeated use of a phrase, command, or channel that causes screen scroll for others. Not only is spam considered rude, but excessive screen scroll can interfere with the game play of anyone seeing it (not to mention combat situations). The game will also tell you to PUT A LID ON IT and force-quit you after the 20th repeat of a single command

It is also considered spam to use the same phrase over several different
channels. The use of all-caps can also be considered spam. Only use
capitals to add emphasis to key words in a sentence.

Moving a large number of items into and out of a container in a crowded,
non-store room is considered spam. Making charmed mobs or pets to cause screen scroll through movement or orders is considered spam. Eating more than one item of food or taking more than one drink from a fountain in a crowded room is considered spam. ANYTHING that causes excessive or irritating screen scroll can be considered spam.

Straight out of the help files on the MUD. So please, save your spammy cure spells for AFTER the roleplay!

[Paxos]

People should also think more on the idea of spam, though. For example, in a situation such as this, I was curing the person. Someone told me to stop, so I did. Three minutes later, in real time, nothing happened on screen after they told me to stop aside from tick echoes. They then told me I could resume healing.

Despite the fact that my healing might have been in the way of something I think that this is a perfect example of someone wanting to stop the spam merely because, "Oh, don't spam..." If there's nothing else going on RP-wise, why is it a problem? This is the only situation I have been in involving something of this sort, as well the fact that this post was made after my exact situation.

Paxos

[Glim]

Its not wrong to cure and such when nothing is going on RP wise, though if there is a large bunch of people asking you to stop, sometimes it would be wise to step out of the room to heal.

Also, cure light wounds spells do create alot of spam, and if you have a higher level cure spell, then use it, even if its at a low skill level, practice makes perfect. Hmm...perhaps this issue could be helped by making it so that the higher the level the spell is, then it gives more favor for each casting. Like 20 cure light wounds spells would give the same favor as 1 heal or the like (not sure if this is what already happens or not actually).

All in all, I think what people are saying is, dont interrupt RP or spam with spells (main reason the market square guard warning was added), dont ask people to stop spamming if nothing is going on and just because it irritates you, and last, stop being greedy for favor.

[Mele]

When you raise someone, they do not come back to life with a bleeding flag. I just want to make the point as well, that raising someone is both painful for the raisee as well as the raiser. I've raised tons of people with my Priestess, and nine times out of ten, if there are others around, their first concern is -my- health, considering all that is taken from me. I think it is poor roleplay for -anyone- to spam cures immediately after a raise, this automatically removes anyones right to roleplay being at 10%hp or whatever, considering they cannot pretend the cures did not happen. I also believe as a matter of respect, any other priest present during a raise situation should not immediately overtake the duties of the performing priest without -something- first. 'Hey bub, can I heal her' 'Might I lessen your load and let you rest?' etc. I mean this is, after all, our job here(as a cleric). How would you feel if someone just walked up and finished your job on you? Blahblah, just giving my two cents. =)

~Danica

[Nysan]

Plain, simple, and to the point. People usually have to find, talk to, and arrange the raising of a person, meaning they want to deal with that priest (sometimes only that priest). If your little priest was not asked to be there, or you were and you just start babbling out spells, thats assault in some places. Unwanted spells is a form of attacking. They don't have to be hostile in nature. Forcing your help on others is not help, its just being mean in a nicer way. To wrap this up, don't help unless asked. Thats all. Its that easy.

Then again, spam healing when asked is fine, I guess, since it is asked for. But heal for the most healing, not the most favor.

N.R.

[Nikkos]

Each priest has his or her own way of roleplaying channeling divine energy into restoring someone's life. Respect the roleplay. Like Mele's priestess, Nikkos also RPs the enormous drain on him, but he also is compelled by his overall RP to heal as many of their wounds as he can as soon as he can. Then he speaks to them of a gift of thanks to Selune and the church.

As a player, I am annoyed when someone else just hops in and starts healing the newly raised person without asking. It's just plain rude to break in and start casting without first asking if your help is needed - or wanted.

[Jadom]

Hmm...perhaps this issue could be helped by making it so that the higher the level the spell is, then it gives more favor for each casting. Like 20 cure light wounds spells would give the same favor as 1 heal or the like (not sure if this is what already happens or not actually).

To me that seems like you'd be rewarding the favorhound though. "If you promise not to disrupt other peoples RP, we'll make sure you get the favor you want."

As mentioned above, the MUD is supposed to be about RP, not numbers and "Do I have enough favour to get that spiffy <insert supplicated object here> to boost my stats?". And since the main issue at hand is priests who will spam cure light spells when they can cast heal or cure critical, it's fairly obvious that the only thing they are doing is fishing for favor, since there is no reason to use 10 spells when you can get the same effect for 1. If you're concern is the health of the newly raised, why would you use dozens of minor cures that will ease their pain very slowly, if you can stop their suffering with a handful of more powerful cures?

At the very least, like Mele said, ask before you start healing. From a roleplay point of view raising the dead is probably one of the greatest powers the Gods grant to their priests, and would have a great effect on both the priest and the person brought back, which is kind of negated when some bystander starts rattling off heal spells like he's balancing his check book :p

[Glim]

I actually think it would reward the ones who actually do use the larger healing spells. Those that dont spam with cure light spells would get rewarded, and since those spells cannot be cast nearly as much as those of the lower variety, there would not be as much spam. It would give those favor hounds a reason not to spam everyone and disrupt RP with cure light spells.

[Jadom]

That is what I mean though, and why I agree with Mystra's decision. The people who are treating the situation appropriately would get rewarded, but by extension so would the favor hounds, because you're not actually making the point that what they are doing is inapprorpriate, you are basically just buying them off.

[Ursan]

I've watched this discussion unfold with some interest, and most of my own thoughts on the etiquette of raising someone have been covered above.

I would like to add one or two things, though.

In all this, everyone has automatically assumed that someone who rattles off cure light spells is doing so for favor gain. In some instances, this might not be the case.

An unfaithed priest will have no healing spell but 'cure light'.
A newly-faithed priest may not yet have learned a better one, or have learned a better one to the same degree of skill.
Some faiths do not have healing spells greater than 'cure light'.
Some faiths will in fact lose favor for healing others.

That said, those who use 'cure light' when other prayers are readily available are certainly abusing the code... for both favor and increasing skill levels.

Timaeus' original posting had the feel of something drawn out of a single incident... the proverbial straw for this particular camel's back.

I think that there is a lot to be said for both parties taking responsibility for the situation. If you are being spammed, ask the person to desist ICly.... give an appropriate reason. Perhaps their actions form part of their roleplay

You might need to explain using an osay or otell, or if you think it useful direct them to 'Help spam'

It is only when someone ignores reason and roleplay or if they are blatantly favor-spamming that they should be brought to task.

[Nysan]

Feel the need to add something I forgot last time. I am not taking the side of spammers and rude rpers, but this is just a bit of advise for raisers and raisies. The less traveled the location of your work is, the less likely the unwanted people will show. I mean, stepping west or east from the market square and try a raise, you almost invite the unwanted to interupt. The few raisings I have been involved in, the ones that were in quieter places never had any unwanteds appear, mostly cause the deed was done in some quiet out of the way place and not in the middle of a well traveled road. Again, this is just a bit of advise.....enjoy.

N.R.

[Rhelian]

Making a quick calculation -

Assume all spells = 1 favour point

Now, change "heal" = 20 favour points

Fact: Person who has a penchant for favour spamming will spam any way possible

Fact: Person will spam "heal" instead and gain desired favour level 20 times faster than normal spam

It's a bad idea, in my opinion, to adjust higher end spells to award more favour, pretty much for the above reason. Those people who don't spam will reach those high favour levels in time and are obviously good enough players to arive when they arive, and not mind the time all that much. Those who want items and favour RIGHT NOW will spam one way or another, and why should they be rewarded for spamming, and having their task made easier?

Also, as to what Nysan posted - how often can you imagine a cleric raising someone in a busy market street when there is holyground a short walk away? If you're that concerned about the character you're raising, you wouldn't want to yank them out of the afterlife, stick them into their body, and have them wake up surrounded by dirt, flies, manure, and a huge crowd of shoppers. Seems like a large gaping hole in the RP there. Go somewhere private for your most-powerful-miracle-granted performances.

[Barson]

As you know, some priests, those whom do not have faiths, only have Cure light.. So some of us are left to only cast cure light in situations. As far as when someone is raised, with my priest I cure them a little bit, enough to move on their own, and bring them from the room so if another is to be raised, my casting wouldn't spam or hinder the ceremony.. if I am a second priest to arive, I wait until they begin their healing spells and join in when there is little being said but the healing prayers. For me its not about favour.. seeing as I don't have a god to get favour from. Well thats my point on the topic

Jadeian Malimane, Wandering healer.