Chaotic Neutral

[Lathander]

My personal opinion is that a CN character is a character that doesn't do either good or evil deeds while doing whatever he feels like

That's the part that cause problems. It is too often used as a weak reasoned defense when imms confront players who play CN as evil.

[Raona]

A better question would perhaps be:

What actions, when made by a CN character, are "playing evil without the aura/restrictions"?

If you are CN, but find yourself doing things to help a cause beyond yourself, be it good or evil, I think you should study it carefully. What's in it for you? Would that putative gain be obvious to the PC, and reasonably compel them to such action?

CNs can have friends, and they wouldn't have many quibbles about the alignments or actions toward others of their ostensible friends. So long as their friends treated them right, and had no reason to expect they wouldn't keep doing so, fine, they are friends. But each individual would be judged on that basis. A CN isn't going to help some stranger on so-and-so's say so. They won't treat Bill as an enemy just because their best buddy Dan hates Bill, or even because Bill is trying to kill Dan. Hey, that's between Dan and Bill. CN's will make up their own mind about everyone, thank you very much, and they are free to change it.

It shouldn't be hard to avoid conflict with a CN. Be civil to them, don't get in their way, they shouldn't have anything against you. (In my interactions with him, I've found Selveem plays this role quite well: I'd hold him up as a model CN in his interpersonal relations, at least with my PCs.)

So, to more directly address Dalvyn's question: If a CN doesn't know you, doesn't have a history with you, and yet is quick to kindness or hostility, something is up. Maybe they have a good reason, but it should be the exception, not the rule.

Joining organizations, period, seems a bit out of sorts for a CN, though, to my eyes. Perhaps a faith, who's ethos focuses on something not distinctly good or evil. (Like battle, nature, technology: the neutral deities.) But not much else.

More concisely, a CN who's "doing whatever he feels like" leaves him indebted, promised, avowed, or even in a position where he/she would be seen as such would raise my eyebrows. Short term mercenary stuff, i.e. most quests, no problem. Just git 'r done. But long term-obligations, affiliations, or expectations should make them uncomfortable. They are chaotic.

These are just my opinions, and as someone who's never played a CN...but has played and thought a lot about playing a true neutral.

[Rawlys]

CN is the most enjoyable alignments I have played, mostly due to the fact that there are no restrictions of my actions (as long as I'm able to endure the consequences of them).

Much like what everyone else has already posted, it's about being carefree. Sure, I have "friends" who are useful to have around at times, but that's primarily because I can't do a particular job by myself. It's about trying to figure out the most instant gratification I can find, but also making sure I don't place myself in a bind later on. Options are my number one priority.

Last thing my character wants is to be placed into a mold. To be told what to do, because he should do that. He'll rebel against such orders for the simple fact that he wants to prove (mainly to himself) that he is his own being. To go against the social norm makes him feel accomplished, by not falling into the trap like everyone else does.

In dealing with good and evils, he would rather hang around goods. They're generally more trusting, less threatening and because of that, easier to be around. With evils, you're constantly having to watch your back, trying to figure out if someone is trying to pull a fast one on you. But at the same time, they're more lenient with the laws of society and understandable about breaking those laws... as long as the laws aren't their laws/rules

Over all, I wouldn't say it's a balancing act between good and evil. It's about picking whichever side is most beneficial for you, at that moment.

[Melusine]

Chaotic Neutral.... Ok. I often hear that its not 'Evil Lite', but it definately isn't 'Good Lite' either. I mean... Any neutral person shouldn't be restricted by who they decide to deal with. The people themselves are just other people. And ICly, its not as though someone's alignment is written on their foreheads. (Yes, of course there's obviously evil people) But yeah... neutrals can do a little good and a little bad, I often see them as 'alignment blind', to a degree. They won't be running around, sacrificing corpses and laughing maniacally... But they also won't be all saintly either.

I have a chaotic neutral who does associate with both good and evil. She tends to hang more with goods, but that's just because she met them first. She was one of those 'we'll see where she lands' kinds of characters.

As for Dalvyn's question of: What actions, when made by a CN character, are "playing evil without the aura/restrictions"?

Well... As for a neutral, personally it would mean a bit of watching overall behavior. And it can be hard to tell, because actions have motives behind them, and there could be perfectly good reasons for them... But as for 'definate evil' actions... wanton slaughter, toying with the weak, killing people just because you can? Some of these things including both PCs and NPCs. I mean, stuff like that, yes, definately. But I think we shouldn't be too hasty to be seeing someone as playing evil, when it really might not be.

[Jaenoic]

One time in high school a friend of mine came into my class to get me for something and my French teacher of the time teasingly said to me, "You know you're judged by the company you keep." It's the reason paladins don't and can't associate with evils, and amongst their close friends and companions they count only LG, NG and LN characters.

Now I'm not saying that associating with evil makes you evil. But if you associate only with evil then why be neutral? Might as well be evil is my opinion. Don't be surprised if you keep mostly evil company and people begin to accuse you of being evil. Like madam Keepers said, you're judged by the company you keep.

"Evil" and "Good" is subject to perception. Social morality.

I don't believe that alignment is relative at all. Respect or challenging of a law is quite clear and reflects neatly on the lawful-chaotic axis. Some believe that the good-evil axis is a bit more fuzzy but I don't believe so. Consider this "simple" rule: if an act brings about more happiness and/or satisfies more desires for the members involved than unhappiness and/or dissatisfaction of desires, that act is good. Conversely if the act brings about more unhappiness/dissatisfaction than happiness/satisfaction, then that act is evil. An act that brings about the same amount of positive and negative exchange, or else the change in happiness/desires is negligible, is a neutral act. Simple right? It works pretty well, though it is utilitarian.(It does not factor in the good of the individual, but rather the good of the group; unless only one person is involved in the act. Then there are personal rights but it gets complicated when you include them. Just remember - thou shalt not kill!)

I believe in order for a character to maintain a neutral alignment, they must balance their good and evil acts. A chaotically neutral character would not necessarily have any order to their acts, in that they would not consciously commit an evil acts because yesterday they did a good act, but their whim would take them to that balance naturally. They would not gravitate permanently to any one side of the axis, and consequently not to any one group of said side. They may one day help a Sharran and another day help a Selunite, because both tasks coincided with their personal belief system. That belief system may say that stealing is ok, but never take a person's freedom away. Doing a task for money is ok because it keeps me alive, but just never take money for killing. So maybe the Sharran hires the character to steal something and pays him well; what does he care what he steals - he's still getting paid, and no one's really getting hurt. But then he'll help the Selunite free some slaves from goblins; those people never deserved to be enslaved, and who's going to miss a few goblins anyway?

So that's my take on a CN character. One who lives by his own belief system and whos actions do not habitually gravitate heavily toward any one side of the spectrum. If their beliefs or consequently the company they choose to keep(because they choose their company based on their beliefs, just as a paladin does) tend to make them act good more often than evil, or evil more often than good, then perhaps you should consider a different alignment.

[Selveem]

Here's my take on a Chaotic Neutral character using Selveem as an example. Take into account that he serves Tempus and has adopted these beliefs throughout these years by speaking to others, especially Druids:

War is a thing of nature. It can unite one nation while tearing apart another. Death in itself is only a part of life as, in the end, it is your body that answers to the command of the blade but your soul to your God thereafter. Death is no atrocious act and should be treated with the same respect as life. There is no good and evil. Do not confuse and frustrate yourself with attempting to understand the difference as the good commit evil and evil commit good. There are combatants and non-combatants. Those who are unable to defend themselves and those who are unwilling to defend themselves. Strive to protect those who are unable to defend themselves so that they may see the value in fighting for one's beliefs and follow the example you set.

This, in a nutshell, is how I RP Selveem. Now, that being said he has committed 'evil' and has committed 'good (more good, unfortunately, but I feel I do a good job of balancing).' He doesn't see them as either, but they were judgements he made after much consideration. Does this make him good or evil?

[Lathander]

I believe in order for a character to maintain a neutral alignment, they must balance their good and evil acts.

This does not mean that a CN can wantonly kill the elves of Tethyr as long as he/she then kills an equal number of orcs in Shilmista. For those of you that are curious, we have been given that, and other similar justifications when confronting such behaviors.

Death is no atrocious act and should be treated with the same respect as life.

The manner in which someone takes another person's life can be an atrocious act. Death between honorable combatants on a battlefield would be different than one where the deceased was tortured for days and eventually died.

There is no good and evil.

Your character can have that perspective, but it isn't true in FK. There is good and there is evil. One can choose to ignore it, or choose to remain neutral regarding it. To deny the existence of it would be a personal rp choice, not a truism. Tempus knows that Cyric exists and that he is evil, just as Tempus knows Tyr exists and that he is good. And the other gods know that Tempus exists and that he doesn't care about good or evil, he just wants to fight.

There is no good and evil......the good commit evil and evil commit good.

Just had to put these two quotes together. If there is no good and evil, how can someone BE good or evil? Further, how could they commit good or evil acts if good and evil do not exist?

[Gwain]

I get to follow the tough acts

To be chaotic neutral is to step away from two halves of a coin. You become a symbol of balanced denial, you give up the choice of doing things one way and then you give up the right to do them another. In essence you straddle the middle, you become what I would term as fifth business. Robertson Davies defines this as follows:

A character of an opera who has no opposite: the odd man out—neither heroine nor her lover, rival nor villain—yet essential to the plot.

Literally, the least important character, but the most essential element to the plot by the end of the show. Because they wrap things up or create the means to nudge the story forward. They don't wrap themselves up in one element of the scene, instead they are everywhere because of their base nature. They don't have to believe in a way, but can work within a belief system to further their goals. In fact, a CN can bounce back and forth elegantly as long as they don't stick to a side. How does this work? Well a chaotic neutral is a loner, an element that cannot be predicted. They won't
commit evil acts or goodly acts unless the plot calls for it. They know the plot simply because they can walk away from it and see what they are doing. If they fail, if the city jails them, if the gods curse them, they don't whine or cringe. They change their lives to adjust or avoid a repeat. They're not crazy or foolishly random, they are outsiders, romantics without intention.

Which is quite hard to understand:

I think I can some it up this way. A CN would not go off and train in a goodly city to become evil later. They do not have the ambition to be the darkest of evils, they are simply training to make a living, for revenge or something else they need to do. Only when a life shattering or environmental event occurs will they change for the worse, otherwise they won't.

Those that think they can play both sides or bounce back after a day are in fact not approaching their alignments correctly. Which is a given, it happens we're not all perfect. The trick is to realize this and work towards fixing it icly through self exploration and accepting consequences. One reason for this is that CN is a devious alignment. It promises chaos first! then it piles on neutrality. It does not mean you can laugh at someone and then stab them...It means you can laugh at someone, and not think twice about aiding them or stopping them. It means you can walk away from someone sacrificing sentients without raising a rallying cry, but not stick around and cook marshmallows on the pyre after.

Evil is evil, good is good, neutral is ducky. A lack of moral compass is important. You don't tip the scales, you sit in the middle, once again the unknown factor. Very few players can manage it and I do sympathize with those that try without breaking rp just to gain items or prestige.

But in the end I think we can subside if people follow this:

1. If you are planning to be evil but want to join a guild specificly made for good to cn neutral characters: DON'T

2. If you want to be CN but wish to spend all your time in a city of Goodly goods or Evil Evils. DON'T: Balance time and do not surround yourself with one extreme over the other.

3. If you want to go do certain quests consider their affects on your alignment. If you go ahead and do them you would not be following it.

4. As a cn character there are things you should not do, like adventure often with elements that reflect poorly on your alignment or become buddy buddy with them/spend all time with them/ marry them. If you do and something happens like you are cursed, accept it or work to right your alignment, don't fight it oocly or do something your pc would not, work towards embracing or solving your problems icly. Don't make them worse.

I will close with this. CN is the hardest alignment. It denies you the most while allowing the most potential in personal rp. If you can't do it right, then you should look to easier alignment choices. Using it to gain advantages that are ooc in nature and goals will only lead to problems.

[Selveem]

There is no good and evil......the good commit evil and evil commit good.

Just had to put these two quotes together. If there is no good and evil, how can someone BE good or evil? Further, how could they commit good or evil acts if good and evil do not exist?

I was explaining Selveem's reasoning for the simple disbelief in the ideals of "good" or "evil."

Good, whether directly or indirectly can commit atrocious crimes by doing "the right thing." A tortured and malnourished Troll is freed by a Priest of Ilmater from the hands of those who are abusing only to find later that said Troll has exacted vengeance upon a nearby townspeople. Good are often used more than any other alignment because of their general predictability. Gaining their help is often just a matter of how you present something.

Evil often guises themselves as good. Capturing said escaped Troll to win over the love of the townspeople remaining for status to use against any assaults on their honor.

There is generally no EVIL EVIL EVIL person. The intelligent evil person is generally the wolf in sheep's clothing.

This is why Selveem has chosen simply not to bother himself with questions as to who is good and who is evil. Because, in the end, neither matter to him. Questions of that sort only confuse issues that should be easy choices.